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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    If you were to remove the Christian "good vs evil" rhetoric then you might be able to objectively look at someone else's spirituality for what they perceive it to be.

    You're unable to do that.

    Sent from my DROID X2 using Forum Runner
    Exactly.

    Einstein was a noted deist and spoke on it frequently. That was more to the point.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  2. #92
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Sorry, but I respectfully submit that Einstein was not a deist. He was Agnostic atheist like most scientists are, not a strong atheist. He believed in scientific pantheism although that term didn't exist in his life time but that's what he was.

    He believed the universe was eternal, so it could not have been “Created”.

    __________________________________
    I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modelled after our own - a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty.
    _________________________________




    http://www.pantheismtoday.com/videos...st-not-a-deist
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-29-2013 at 07:59 AM.




  3. #93
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    You can be sorry all you want. Just know you're wrong. That's the danger of typing into google a questions and finding exactly what you're looking for.

    And I clarified my remarks to mean spiritual.

    Einstein believed in Spinoza's God, that is he believed in a God, just not a personal one.

    In his biography, written Walter Isaacson, Einstein was very clear he was not an atheist and repeatedly rejected the notion. Perhaps a change in tactics is in order, Trap. Having a web site simply means the check cleared.

    I'll take a biographer over a web site every day of the week.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  4. #94

    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
    Does this question not assume that we perceive things - such as "evil" - the same way that God perceives these things? Is that a logical assumption to be making?
    Last edited by JohnBKistler; 05-29-2013 at 09:18 AM.




  5. #95
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBKistler View Post
    Does this question not assume that we perceive things - such as "evil" - the same way that God perceives these things? Is that a logical assumption to be making?
    "Evil" is a relative term. We apply it to things that we, as humans, find negative or subversive and cannot explain.

    Is a Lion evil for eating an animal in the plains of Africa? The Lion's prey may think so, but the prey doesn't understand how delicious it is for the Lion.

    There is no governing body of evil, or good.
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  6. #96
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    You can be sorry all you want. Just know you're wrong. That's the danger of typing into google a questions and finding exactly what you're looking for.

    And I clarified my remarks to mean spiritual.

    Yea, after I challenged your religious remark.
    He's not even spiritual. Believing that God is the universe is not spiritual.



    Einstein believed in Spinoza's God, that is he believed in a God, just not a personal one.

    That was my line above. I listed the Spinoza reference but believing that God
    is the universe is not spiritual.


    In his biography, written Walter Isaacson, Einstein was very clear he was not an atheist and repeatedly rejected the notion. Perhaps a change in tactics is in order, Trap. Having a web site simply means the check cleared.

    I'll take a biographer over a web site every day of the week.



    Im listing people who are educated on the subject. I posted links. Re-read the link,
    it posted references from authors and gave a direct quote from Einstein himself saying he is Agnostic. You just say he talked about it w/o posting anything.

    YOu can't prove that my links are wrong.

    Here's another direct quote from one of the authors in the above link. This is a
    direct quote from a letter from Einstein to Berkowitz, Oct 1950 just 5 years before
    his death in 1955. You can't get any better than that.

    You can't deny this but you will.

    ______________________________________________________
    My position concerning God is that of an agnostic. I am convinced that a vivid consciousness of the primary importance of moral principles for the betterment and ennoblement of life does not need the idea of a law-giver, especially a law-giver who works on the basis of reward and punishment." (Albert Einstein in a letter to M. Berkowitz, October 25, 1950; Einstein Archive 59–215; from Alice Calaprice, ed., The New Quotable Einstein, Princeton, New Jersey: Prin
    __________________________________________
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-29-2013 at 02:25 PM.




  7. #97
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    So you've now graduated to wiki for your quotes.

    Yeah, I am going to stick to what a researcher has to say on the topic. Might want to give this piece of scholarly research a read:

    http://press.princeton.edu/chapters/s6681.pdf
    Last edited by HoustonRaven; 05-29-2013 at 02:12 PM.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  8. #98
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    .
    Last edited by HoustonRaven; 05-29-2013 at 03:15 PM.




  9. #99
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    Leave out the insults, Trap.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  10. #100
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Leave out the insults, Trap.
    I respoinded to your insult about an un-true statement and you've mocked me plenty
    of times in both forums but I'll apologize.

    That's where Einstein misses the boat. I'll ask God to forgive me.
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-29-2013 at 04:05 PM.




  11. #101
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    I seem to recall that two of the most intelligent scientists in human history, Sir Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein, were both religious.

    Both thought they were attempting to figure out the mind of God.

    Both thought the universe was so splendid, so spectacular that it could only have been the work of something divine.

    Guess they're just "illogical".
    They sure could have been. Geniuses can fall into traps of illogicality. Anyone can because everyone is human.

    For every Newton and Einstein there is at least one scientist who is an atheist (probably more). So, I wouldn't go that route to make any sort of point.

    And for the record, Einstein was an agnostic pantheist: a fancy way of saying he admitted he didn't know if there was a god or not but chose to believe that if there was one, it was identical to nature itself and had no mind or human qualities. (A far cry from "religious" as you said.)




  12. #102
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    It's not like that at all, but since you seem to think that's the only point we've got and you can call it "invalid" as if that means your right, that's cool.
    I call your point invalid because it is.

    You, Sirdowski, and Jonboy: Something can't come from nothing. But god can come from nothing.
    Me: You just contradicted yourself.
    You: No we didn't, because god isn't a something, god is a someone.
    Me: All someones are somethings.

    /thread




  13. #103
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    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by akashicrecorder View Post
    I call your point invalid because it is.

    You, Sirdowski, and Jonboy: Something can't come from nothing. But god can come from nothing.
    Me: You just contradicted yourself.
    You: No we didn't, because god isn't a something, god is a someone.
    Me: All someones are somethings.

    /thread
    So, by than by that very standard, your belief of how the universe started is also, invalid. Correct?
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  14. #104

    Re: How can anyone still believe in God

    Quote Originally Posted by akashicrecorder View Post
    I call your point invalid because it is.

    You, Sirdowski, and Jonboy: Something can't come from nothing. But god can come from nothing.
    Me: You just contradicted yourself.
    You: No we didn't, because god isn't a something, god is a someone.
    Me: All someones are somethings.

    /thread

    OK let me correct you then.
    All natural things, events and beings have a cause. that long string of caused events msut have an un-caused CAUSE.

    That Un-caused cause must be SUPERNATURAL as, ALL NATURAL things, events and beings have a precursor cause.

    That suoernatural event, thing, being that is the uncaused cause can sometimes be called God. It s supernatural, in the sense that it is not of this natural world(and by world i mean the entirety of matter in the universe).




  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post

    OK let me correct you then.
    All natural things, events and beings have a cause. that long string of caused events msut have an un-caused CAUSE.

    That Un-caused cause must be SUPERNATURAL as, ALL NATURAL things, events and beings have a precursor cause.

    That suoernatural event, thing, being that is the uncaused cause can sometimes be called God. It s supernatural, in the sense that it is not of this natural world(and by world i mean the entirety of matter in the universe).
    Aliens.

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