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  1. #61

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?



    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Yet another lowball defensive contract. Brent Grimes gets $5.5M for one year. Last year he played under the franchise tag for $10M.

    Last year guys like Carr and finnegan were getting 5 year contracts for $10M per year.

    Now Grimes, Talib can only land 1 years deals for $5M?????? Hmmm......
    So you think Grimes is worth $10 million, when he's not even recovered from an Achilles injury? And Talib is a walking time bomb. What color is the sky on your planet?
    I've upped my standards. Up yours.




  2. #62
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by moose10101 View Post
    So you think Grimes is worth $10 million, when he's not even recovered from an Achilles injury? And Talib is a walking time bomb. What color is the sky on your planet?
    Dead on. Both of these guys have issues. They've been visiting multiple teams and tried to get more money but teams weren't going to bite.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  3. #63
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    I now think the collusion is on the owner's behalf. So perhaps my initial suspicion re: players was off, but the general suspicion I think was accurate. Screwy things are happening.

    And this is backed by agents right now. I recently had a current agent speak at my school. The players got completely screwed. Just look at the contracts we are seeing.

    But here is the interesting macro view. The NFL is worried about "player safety" only because of potential lawsuits. However, we all know they want more offense and less defense. Look at all of the rules in the past few years protecting QBs and WRs.

    Look at what happened this year in free agency. The only players that got $10M/year on average were either WRs or QBs.

    A few years ago DEs and CBs were getting top dollar. Now their market is depressed.

    They are devaluing positions that hurt points being scored. They want the league to be point point points, because supposedly that is what sells. Fantasy football in real life.

    Even crappy backup QBs are getting better contracts than established DEF players. Who is setting these contract ceilings? Dumervil went from making $12M to $8M to averaging $5.5M. Huh???

    Look at why Dal and Wash got punished for their salary cap issues in the uncapped year. They frontloaded contracts (e.g. big $$ up front - aka expensive business).The league - aka the owners - want(ed) the salary cap low so they can continue to fake their "hardships" and teams not being profitable. The same excuses they used during the lock out. Dal and Wash are being punished because they didn't fall in line with the rest of the owners. aka they didn't collude.

    So what do we have this year? A relatively flat salary cap, a huge veteran purge (the middle class dropped out re: contract value(s)), veterans getting horrible contracts for little money. But QBs and WRs getting paid still (see Flacco, Mike Wallace, Bowe, etc.).

    What a coincidence that the two positions that score points and make those long incredible passes/catches are getting all the $$, while LBs, etc. are getting scraps.

    You can think I am off my rocker but this stuff is really being talked about by agents in the industry.
    I don't think this is collusion at all, I think it's the logical endpoint of the union's stupid and short-sighted embrace of the rookie wage scale. By making rookies dirt cheap relative to veteran role players, the union created a market wherein the price of elite players/established QBs went way up, while "proven veterans" were squeezed out by the cost difference with rookies. This was entirely predictable to anyone who wasn't an NFL player who doesn't understand that no one gets paid for "what they've done."




  4. #64

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Yet another lowball defensive contract. Brent Grimes gets $5.5M for one year. Last year he played under the franchise tag for $10M.

    Last year guys like Carr and finnegan were getting 5 year contracts for $10M per year.

    Now Grimes, Talib can only land 1 years deals for $5M?????? Hmmm......
    So your premise is that this off season the owners decided to collude against defensive players? It has nothing to do with the collective bargaining agreement because as you just pointed out last year there were big contracts for defensive players. A few basic questions: Why would the owners collude against defensive players? What is the benefit to them?

    NFL owners and GMs are not going to collude on how to spend their money under the cap. They are going to do everything they can to win. They colluded under the uncapped year because they wanted a collective advantage when negotiating with the NFLPA. That is over and done with and in signing the agreement the NFLPA forfeited the right to pursue collusion.




  5. #65

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Asomugha. 1 year $3M dollar deal.

    Two years ago he was the top free agent and got paid over $10M per. I think closer to $12M per.

    His value dropped 75% in two seasons.




  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Asomugha. 1 year $3M dollar deal.

    Two years ago he was the top free agent and got paid over $10M per. I think closer to $12M per.

    His value dropped 75% in two seasons.
    The fact that he played like shit is probably unrelated. Definitely collusion.
    My motto was always to keep swinging. Whether I was in a slump or feeling badly or having trouble off the field, the only thing to do was keep swinging. -Hank Aaron




  7. #67

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by ActualSpamBot View Post
    The fact that he played like shit is probably unrelated. Definitely collusion.
    Look at the length and value of veteran defensive players contracts this year. There is a dramatic reduction in value from years past

    I know he hasn't played well. His base salary is $1.35M. $600k or so over veteran minimum.




  8. #68
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    I heard a very interesting interview with Drew Pearson the Cowboys receiver. Pearson contends that teams are so worried about the concussion issue that they don't want players over 30 except for QBs where they have enough trouble finding good players. Pearson's contention is that you are going to see a lot more of these 1 and 2 years deals and for many players over 30 there will be no deals. I'm not sure if he's right but it makes a lot of sense.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  9. #69
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Look at the length and value of veteran defensive players contracts this year. There is a dramatic reduction in value from years past
    Of course it is, because the market is fundamentally different now with the rookie pay scale (and there being kind of a lot of defensive players out there for the getting). The same thing just happened in baseball.




  10. #70
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    I think reaching the conclusion of collusion because market is "depressed" this year is tenuous at best. First, that theory ignores that the cap has not increased this year and most likely will not increase until the new TV contract in 2016 (I believe). Teams are close to the cap. Second, it is ignoring that this is a young mans league. With the new rookie salary scale, younger players are going to get the contracts to keep costs down, and allow talented veterans get paid. Third, for their to be collusion among the owners and gm presumes the theory that people can keep a secret. Sorry, that is where this all falls apart. People can't keep secrets. Someone on a staff would be a whistle blower. Also, Teams are about winning now. They are not going to lose to keep the market down for the greater good of the NFL.




  11. #71

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    I heard a very interesting interview with Drew Pearson the Cowboys receiver. Pearson contends that teams are so worried about the concussion issue that they don't want players over 30 except for QBs where they have enough trouble finding good players. Pearson's contention is that you are going to see a lot more of these 1 and 2 years deals and for many players over 30 there will be no deals. I'm not sure if he's right but it makes a lot of sense.
    Certainly interesting and plausible.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  12. #72

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    I heard a very interesting interview with Drew Pearson the Cowboys receiver. Pearson contends that teams are so worried about the concussion issue that they don't want players over 30 except for QBs where they have enough trouble finding good players. Pearson's contention is that you are going to see a lot more of these 1 and 2 years deals and for many players over 30 there will be no deals. I'm not sure if he's right but it makes a lot of sense.
    Makes a lot more sense than the "C" word.
    I've upped my standards. Up yours.




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