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  1. #151
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?



    Quote Originally Posted by moose10101 View Post
    I'd love to see an agent call BS using the NFLPA numbers, now that we know that those numbers are totally eff'd:

    http://russellstreetreport.com/forum...ens-Cap-Update

    How can you "forget" to include a player who signed his $2 million tender more than a week ago? And how can you apply a bonus that wasn't paid? What an embarrassment.
    They are probably too busy wondering why no one will offer their All Pro player more than a 1 year deal for $2M (or less).




  2. #152

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    They are probably too busy wondering why no one will offer their All Pro player more than a 1 year deal for $2M.
    Please tell us which current All Pro only got a 1/$2 offer. And please don't waste our time naming players who made All Pro three years ago.

    BTW, your attempt to deflect attention from the NFLPA's epic fail is noted. It, too, was an epic fail.
    I've upped my standards. Up yours.




  3. #153

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post

    Please show me an example of the last time agents were complaining about collusion during free agency.
    Please show a time where FA market was soft and the NFLPA did not claim collusion.

    No one is disputing that the FA market is soft. The issue is why.

    The salary cap has not been raised as much in recent years. There is a new rookie salary cap/pool. There is now a salary cap floor. QBs are signing increasingly large contracts. Two of the biggest spending teams (Cowboys and Redskins) are temporarily penalized and prevented from entering the fray as much as usual (penalties which the NFLPA inexplicably supported). All facts and possible reasons. Owner collusion? Not a fact, and no evidence thus far; either in terms communication/cooperation between owners, or even as far as anyone can tell, in terms of overall cap spending by clubs.




  4. #154

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    This is ONE poster who clearly doesn't know what he's talking about. He just wants his claims to be validated. Logic is not going to change this dude's mind, plenty of people have refuted what he's said and he's just continued to repeat himself. Only thing to do is stop arguing with him so the thread goes away.




  5. #155
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by moose10101 View Post
    Please tell us which current All Pro only got a 1/$2 offer. And please don't waste our time naming players who made All Pro three years ago.

    BTW, your attempt to deflect attention from the NFLPA's epic fail is noted. It, too, was an epic fail.
    You don't know what parameters the NFLPA is using when generating their list. And I never said the NFLPA was a good union anyway. In fact, they are quite shitty in comparison to other sports unions.

    I don't know the offers because I am not an agent. And I am not a beat reporter with inside contacts. All I can see are the deals that have been signed. And to me it seems there are a plethora of 1 year, low $$ contracts.

    And I am not going to do a line item comparison with previous years when this free agency period isn't even over, we are only in year 2 of the rookie wage scale system, and as I've already stated - one year likely isn't enough to show a clear pattern.

    But I also don't expect this issue to go away.




  6. #156
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by NjRavensFan View Post
    This is ONE poster who clearly doesn't know what he's talking about. He just wants his claims to be validated. Logic is not going to change this dude's mind, plenty of people have refuted what he's said and he's just continued to repeat himself. Only thing to do is stop arguing with him so the thread goes away.
    Actually I see a bunch of people that have no fucking clue about antitrust regulations.

    Someone here please answer the following:

    1) Are the 32 NFL teams viewed as 1 entity, or 32 separate entities?
    2) How does the answer to 1) impact application of section 1 of the Sherman Act with regards to the market for player contracts and potential collusion?
    Last edited by bt12483; 04-04-2013 at 02:08 PM.




  7. #157
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    The "grapevine" consists of about 715 agents registered with the NFL.

    Please show me an example of the last time agents were complaining so loudly about collusion during free agency.
    He's still regurgitating what he's heard. That's like me telling him I've seen BA get jiggy with a man, then he tweets,m "hearing BA is gay". He is not a source of evidence, I am the source.

    So in this case the agents are the source, ie you've only got one source, not multiple as you've claimed.




  8. #158
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    Two of the biggest spending teams (Cowboys and Redskins) are temporarily penalized and prevented from entering the fray as much as usual (penalties which the NFLPA inexplicably supported). All facts and possible reasons. Owner collusion? Not a fact, and no evidence thus far; either in terms communication/cooperation between owners, or even as far as anyone can tell, in terms of overall cap spending by clubs.
    Do you know who punished WASH and DAL?

    Do you know why they were punished?

    They were punished because they didn't collude.

    Finally, as to the notion that the NFL approved the various contracts that took excessive advantage of the uncapped year in 2010, it’s critical to consider the broader context. The union already was prepared to pounce on any possible evidence of collusion. If the NFL had decided to reject contracts because teams were taking advantage of rules that the teams had every right to take advantage of, the NFLPA would have sued — and the case would have been bolstered by the fact that, on at least six occasions, the NFL had told the teams not to treat the uncapped year as a salary dump. So the NFL approved the contracts and delayed punishment until a point where the league had leverage to persuade the union to agree to an effort to take action after the fact against teams that refused to collude.
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...cap-sanctions/




  9. #159

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    I have been away from the board for a few days, but I got quite a laugh in on this one.

    1 Completely deluional poster vs The entire Logical world.
    Priceless.

    Here you go, here is a simple one for you,. Compare Ellerbe's contract to teh contracts received by David Hawethorne, Curtis Lofton and Stephen Tulloch. Few, if any, people would explain that Ellerbe is the best of the bunch, but he got paid the most BY A LOT. WHY?
    SUPPLY
    and
    DEMAND.
    Last year the market was flooded with MLB'ers and few jobs available. This year, quite the opposite, Ellerbe was CLEARLYthe best aailabel young option, and and more then a few teams interested.




  10. #160

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    You don't know what parameters the NFLPA is using when generating their list. And I never said the NFLPA was a good union anyway. In fact, they are quite shitty in comparison to other sports unions.
    If it's not current data, it's worthless.


    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    I don't know the offers because I am not an agent. And I am not a beat reporter with inside contacts. All I can see are the deals that have been signed. And to me it seems there are a plethora of 1 year, low $$ contracts.
    Great. Cite a 1/$2 signed by a current All Pro. Absent that, can you even name one current All Pro who isn't signed and isn't expected to get a good offer? You brought it up; now (for once) you need to back it up.
    I've upped my standards. Up yours.




  11. #161
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by arnie_uk View Post
    He's still regurgitating what he's heard. That's like me telling him I've seen BA get jiggy with a man, then he tweets,m "hearing BA is gay". He is not a source of evidence, I am the source.

    So in this case the agents are the source, ie you've only got one source, not multiple as you've claimed.
    There are only two sources anyway.

    Owners.

    NFLPA (which includes the agents they register)

    By the very nature of the business you have a 2 party system. Who else is supposed to give information about the private negotiations between the 2 parties? The fly on the wall?




  12. #162
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Actually I see a bunch of people that have no fucking clue about antitrust regulations.

    Someone here please answer the following:

    1) Are the 32 NFL teams viewed as 1 entity, or 32 separate entities?
    2) How does the answer to 1) impact application of section 1 of the Sherman Act with regards to the market for player contracts and potential collusion?
    Answer this question. What does any of this have to do with what your "evidence"?
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  13. #163
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by moose10101 View Post
    Great. Cite a 1/$2 signed by a current All Pro. Absent that, can you even name one current All Pro who isn't signed and isn't expected to get a good offer? You brought it up; now (for once) you need to back it up.
    Huff was All Pro 2010. As was John Abraham (currently unsigned).

    Nothing I say will convince you anyway.




  14. #164
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    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    There are only two sources anyway.

    Owners.

    NFLPA (which includes the agents they register)

    By the very nature of the business you have a 2 party system. Who else is supposed to give information about the private negotiations between the 2 parties? The fly on the wall?
    So if there is only two sources why do you keep bringing up Aaron wilson, which a number if people have admitted is the reason they jumped into the conversation?




  15. #165

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Huff was All Pro 2010. As was John Abraham (currently unsigned).

    Nothing I say will convince you anyway.
    Abraham is a hundred years old, and Huff plays one of the lowest valued positions on a football field, DIDN"T EVEN PLAY THAT POSITION LAST YEAR, and th only reported suitor not Baltimore had 50k in slaary cap space.




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