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Thread: WRs

  1. #25

    Re: WRs



    Quote Originally Posted by ursula View Post
    A question as I am not a very good evaluator of WR's:

    About Ryan Swope- I think I am right that he mainly played slot in college, but with his speed and okay size couldn't he possibly be considered out wider and compete for the X? Again I don't know if this is silly or what...

    Great info you are giving us!
    Good question and not silly at all

    Basically, your slot guy needs to be able to find or create space very quickly. So quick feet and quick leg turnover are key. These factors are also key once the reception has been made--running away from the bracketed zone coverage of the OLB and safety.

    Match-up: Many if not most NFL teams are not fortunate enough to have 3rd CB that can well cover quick slot guys. IOW, just b/c they are in that role that doesn't mean that they can perform. With QB accuracy in the NFL, all you need is one step and you are open. The slot WR has a two yard cushion to use to his advantage, and the good ones have most often already "won" the route by their 4th or 5th step (not stride, but step). Watch tape on Welker, Cruz and Colston for this.

    Why not Swope out-wide? In some offenses, he could be positioned there. I think he's quick enough and strong enough. Teams that run 2 TEs quite a bit could also put Swope out-wide. Generally, team-by-team though, it's about the personnel that you already have onboard.

    For us, Torrey is very fast, we know. However, he's a strider, and throttling up and down while settling into holes in the middle zones is not something he will do well. He also doesn't give a good fake, so you want to keep him outside. The ball often comes faster in the slot, or the ball is pretty much right in your face as you turn your head; so you want a good hands catcher. (Note: I just happened to be watching our NYG game right now. Our 1st TD vs. NYG...it was a 6 yard slant from the slot. Joe threw a bullet and Torrey plucked it with his hands. What has to be factored in though is how awful Corey Webster is in coverage, and that NYG was caught in a blitz and Caldwell had the perfect play called.) Until he perfects his route running though, Torrey should be used very conservatively in the slot.

    About JJ12. He's similar to Torrey, but with less effective hands, and not even as quick laterally.

    Boldin worked in the slot, b/c he was the best of three bad options. Down the stretch he was able to create space with his body/strength vs. man, certainly not his feet or speed. The general timing and trust that he had developed with Joe over three years was the perhaps the greatest factor in his/their success down the stretch.
    Back to the AFCCG we go. So get ready!

    Team MVP to-date: Rick Wagner and C.J. Mosley (tie)

    Having fun talking football on Twitter @BigPlayReceiver




  2. #26

    Re: WRs

    Are we assuming Allen has no chance to get to 32 because I see little discussion...I am also a huge fan of Justin Hunter out of Tennessee who could be anywhere from a 1st to a 2nd rounder...




  3. #27

    Re: WRs

    I think Allen is a terrific athlete and very good with the ball in his hands. I've warmed up to him some since back in Dec and Jan. However, I see him as a 1st round athlete, not a 1st round WR. His injury concerns me. I can only see him falling to 32 if he has a pro day and struggles b/c he's not fully healed/recovered...something unusual like that.

    I've warmed up to Justin Hunter also. Another terrific athlete, but not a terrific receiver. I can't trust his knee though.
    If we take a WR that early, it's a big deal, b/c its a rarity for this franchise. Maybe we'd like a cleaner medical sheet, maybe not.
    Back to the AFCCG we go. So get ready!

    Team MVP to-date: Rick Wagner and C.J. Mosley (tie)

    Having fun talking football on Twitter @BigPlayReceiver




  4. #28

    Re: WRs

    I don't get the relative hate for DeAndre Hopkins. He''s not remotely comparable to Tavarres King, for example.

    What are his weaknesses?




  5. #29
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    Re: WRs

    If the Ravens are looking for a underrated, developmental receiver in the mid-rounds, they could do a lot worse than Corey Fuller (VA Tech). He isn't afraid to go over the middle and has decent hands. He could use work on his routes, but he does have serious speed. He doesn't look like your typical "track guy trying to play football".




  6. #30
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    Re: WRs

    Quote Originally Posted by alien bird View Post
    If the Ravens are looking for a underrated, developmental receiver in the mid-rounds, they could do a lot worse than Corey Fuller (VA Tech). He isn't afraid to go over the middle and has decent hands. He could use work on his routes, but he does have serious speed. He doesn't look like your typical "track guy trying to play football".
    Not saying you're wrong, but don't the Ravens already have enough "developmental receivers"? Doss, Streeter, D. Thompson, and LQ Williams, even David Reed ... Bc




  7. #31

    Re: WRs

    Big fan of Rogers.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  8. #32
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    Re: WRs

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    Not saying you're wrong, but don't the Ravens already have enough "developmental receivers"? Doss, Streeter, D. Thompson, and LQ Williams, even David Reed ... Bc
    Maybe, and that's why I qualified my comment with "if the Ravens were looking. . . "

    I'm not sold on any of those guys currently on the Ravens. With the exception of Doss and Reed as potential possession receivers, those guys seem to be seriously lacking. They all remind me of Justin Harper.

    I would love to see the Ravens get a major upgrade over any of those guys. And an upgrade over Jacoby Jones, who really can't catch. Return man, yes. Receiver, no. Getting a guy like Andre Hopkins, Da'Rick Rogers, Markus Wheaton, Quinton Patton, Robert Woods - that would be my preference.




  9. #33

    Re: WRs

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Big fan of Rogers.
    If his head is on straight he's becoming my favorite pick as a 2nd round guy that has legit outside receiver ability. He could give us something after the catch that we really havent had and he still has the speed an athleticism to get deep as well.




  10. #34

    Re: WRs

    Quote Originally Posted by Mizerooskie View Post
    I don't get the relative hate for DeAndre Hopkins. He''s not remotely comparable to Tavarres King, for example.

    What are his weaknesses?
    Not sure if this was for the group or me, but I have Hopkins valued two rounds higher than King. Our FO might have him valued much higher. Hell, they had a 1st round grade on Torrey and felt like they HAD to take him at #57. FWIW, I like Torrey a lot and liked him at Maryland, but in no way did I think that he was 1st round material.

    Back to Hopkins, from what I've read, Hopkins' work ethic is excellent and many in the Clemson football community were surprised with how far he had come in just one off-season. That's the kind of stuff that our FO loves and values, so we very well may have 1st round grade on him, and will snag him at 32.

    That said, my comment still stands. No hate. Just an evaluation.
    Back to the AFCCG we go. So get ready!

    Team MVP to-date: Rick Wagner and C.J. Mosley (tie)

    Having fun talking football on Twitter @BigPlayReceiver




  11. #35

    Re: WRs

    Re-slotting a bit after balancing my points system. Essentially, I put a greater weight on explosiveness (bench + bj + vj) and dialed down college production a bit. The guys in each round are in order of preference now. FWIW, the 2nd round group is tightly bunched. Wheaton's relative big move is due to his extremely high explosive index plus excellent foot speed (20 shuttle + 3 cone time). These numbers also took TJ Moe from UDFA to the 4th round. Moe had the highest explosive index and greatest foot speed among the WRs at the Combine...maybe of any position. His slow 40 time doesn't matter to me.

    1st - Tavon Austin WVU
    2nd - Markus Wheaton Oregon, Da'Rick Rogers TNTech, Quinton Patton LATech, Keenan Allen Cal, DeAndre Hopkins Clemson, Cordarrelle Patterson TN
    3rd - Studman Bailey WVU, Robert Woods USC, Justin Hunter TN
    4th - Chad Bumphis MSST, TJ Moe Mizz, Uzoma Nwachukwu TX A&M, Tavarres King UGA, Ryan Swope TX A&M, Aaron Dobson Marshall, Aaron Mellette Elon
    5th - Ryan Spadola Leigh, Jasper Collins MtU, Connor Vernon Duke, Kenny Stiles OU, Terrance Williams BAY, Chris Harper KSU
    6th - Zach Rogers TN, Darius Johnson SMU

    Elite WR: None
    Elite athlete: Austin
    Highest ceiling: Austin if used properly; Da'Rick Rogers, generally

    Great potential (distance from current perceived value to future production): Bumphis and Moe
    Greatest risk: Patterson, if taken in the 1st round by anyone besides STL or MIN (each has 2 1st rd picks); Hunter if taken higher than #62

    Preferred day 1 starter in the slot for Ravens: Austin
    Who I could live with in the slot for Ravens: Patton, Bumphis and Moe

    Preferred day 1 starter out-wide for Ravens: Wheaton
    Who I could live with out-wide for Ravens: Rogers, Allen and Hopkins

    What would be surprising, but provide good value?: Taking Patton on a trade-back into the middle 2nd
    What can I see our FO doing?: Taking Wheaton at #62
    What what I do? (safe scenario): Get Wheaton at #62 + Take Bumphis at #129/130
    What would I do? (aggresive scenario): Trade-up or back into the upper 3rd for Rogers + Take Bumphis at #129/130
    Back to the AFCCG we go. So get ready!

    Team MVP to-date: Rick Wagner and C.J. Mosley (tie)

    Having fun talking football on Twitter @BigPlayReceiver




  12. #36
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    Re: WRs

    Quote Originally Posted by Carey View Post
    Just watched Nwachukwu for the first time and i came away really impressed....
    He ran 4.45 at his Pro Day, but he also had a near 40" vertical and 10' 10" broad jump. The guy could be a late round gem.




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