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  1. #16
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?



    Quote Originally Posted by chicagoravensfan View Post
    Flacco with the 2012/13 playoff offensive line + Boldin in beast-mode is a franchise QB.

    Flacco eating up 1/6 of the cap with Oher and Jah Reid as starting tackles and Tandon Doss as #2 WR is a disaster.
    Hyperbole.




  2. #17
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Furthermore, without Cam, Flacco is poised to carry this team back to the playoffs and lock up home field advantage. The Ravens still have enough talent in place in all three phases of the game, and Ozzie is good enough, smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like him. Oz will pick up value FAs and a couple of undrafted rookies, plus have another good/great draft. This is the way this team and front office operate year in and year out. It is just how it works, and thank goodness it works this way.

    What happens in the playoffs is anyone's guess, because you just never know. But you can take Flacco as a top QB who can put the team on his back to the bank. And Joe will be escorting the team there (the bank and the playoffs) and have a new contract signed right before the deadline, and not any earlier.




  3. #18

    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    The players you mentioned were non QB's.

    QB's are treated differently. Look at what the Slurs gave up to get RG III who was unproven.

    Flacco is a SB MVP that's proven to be good and sometimes great in the reg. season. If I am the Browns with the cap room a good offensive line and a defense I give up the 2 1st rounders plus the $100 mil contract for a guy that could eventually take them to the SB. In addition they would still have enough cap room to add a Mike Wallace which could make that offense top 5.

    The Ravens have no choice but to give Joe the exclusive tender.




  4. #19
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravens75 View Post
    The players you mentioned were non QB's.

    QB's are treated differently. Look at what the Slurs gave up to get RG III who was unproven.

    Flacco is a SB MVP that's proven to be good and sometimes great in the reg. season. If I am the Browns with the cap room a good offensive line and a defense I give up the 2 1st rounders plus the $100 mil contract for a guy that could eventually take them to the SB. In addition they would still have enough cap room to add a Mike Wallace which could make that offense top 5.

    The Ravens have no choice but to give Joe the exclusive tender.
    Exactly. The Browns either get the franchise QB they've been trying to find for decades or stick the Ravens with a contract that screws up the season. It's win/win for them. That's why the Ravens can't let them even get a chance at Flacco.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  5. #20

    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by chicagoravensfan View Post
    Kicked off by Tony's article (http://russellstreetreport.com/non-e...g-with-flacco/), I had a few more thoughts on why the Ravens should use the non-exclusive tag.

    Last year there were countless stories about how some team was going to swoop in on Mike Wallace or Lardarius Webb to steal them away from cap-strapped teams. Never happened. In Mike Wallace's case, the cost was only 1 first-rounder and the team would have only had to better the $2.5 million RFA tender price. In order to steal Flacco from the Ravens, the team would have to:

    1) give up 2 first round picks
    2) structure the contract such that the Ravens couldn't match. That would have to be something in the magnitude of $60 million guaranteed to make the year 1 salary cap hit in the $25 million range
    3) convince Flacco that it's worth leaving a great situation. Would he really leave a model franchise to get destroyed behind the Arizona offensive line for an extra $10 million?

    As awesome as Flacco's post-season run is, the guy is not on the Brees/Rodgers/Peyton/Brady level where he can turn a crap team into a Super Bowl contender. With a good o-line and good weapons he can go all the way, but without the right supporting cast we get games like last year's against Jacksonville or this year against Kansas City, Houston or Denver.

    I also suspect there is a good deal of collusion around RFA's (especially under the new CBA which does not allow poison pills). Owners don't mess with other teams RFA's so that their's don't get messed with.

    Right player - right price. If the cost of the exclusive franchise tag is losing Ellerbe, Boldin, Jacoby and/or a starting caliber LT, it is too steep a price.
    Are you related to p king or are you p king. Flacco's here to stay and anyone thinking the Ravens won't do whatever it takes to keep him needs help. Ravens new leader is Joe Flacco and the Ravens will be geared up every year to play in post season. Play quiet with a big arm will be Flaccos theme and other teams will see him for a while setting more records . Peter king and other talking heads have looked bad in their predictions about the Ravens and Flacco. Lot of talking heads had to eat Raven after winning the SB.
    Last edited by lovefootball; 02-20-2013 at 12:06 PM.




  6. #21

    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    You also have to remember that letting Flacco go would be a mistake of "curse of the Bambino" type proportions. The Ravens have to keep this guy. They have nobody else to put in there. Tyrod Taylor is not an NFL QB, and nobody wants to start the QB carousel again. We don't have the dominant defense to sustain it anymore. Of course Flacco and his agent know this, and like anyone else, they're going to take advantage of the situation. This is what the Ravens get for not getting the deal done last season, or better yet, the season before last. If our FO has one major flaw, it's waiting until the last minute to get guys resigned and then paying full price or more. It happens all the time. They did lock Rice up early, but they still overpaid. They should have been focusing on Flacco then. RBs practically grow on trees in this league. Franchise QBs come along once every seventeen years.




  7. #22
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by chicagoravensfan View Post
    Kicked off by Tony's article (http://russellstreetreport.com/non-e...g-with-flacco/), I had a few more thoughts on why the Ravens should use the non-exclusive tag.

    Last year there were countless stories about how some team was going to swoop in on Mike Wallace or Lardarius Webb to steal them away from cap-strapped teams. Never happened. In Mike Wallace's case, the cost was only 1 first-rounder and the team would have only had to better the $2.5 million RFA tender price. In order to steal Flacco from the Ravens, the team would have to:

    1) give up 2 first round picks
    2) structure the contract such that the Ravens couldn't match. That would have to be something in the magnitude of $60 million guaranteed to make the year 1 salary cap hit in the $25 million range
    3) convince Flacco that it's worth leaving a great situation. Would he really leave a model franchise to get destroyed behind the Arizona offensive line for an extra $10 million?

    As awesome as Flacco's post-season run is, the guy is not on the Brees/Rodgers/Peyton/Brady level where he can turn a crap team into a Super Bowl contender. With a good o-line and good weapons he can go all the way, but without the right supporting cast we get games like last year's against Jacksonville or this year against Kansas City, Houston or Denver.

    I also suspect there is a good deal of collusion around RFA's (especially under the new CBA which does not allow poison pills). Owners don't mess with other teams RFA's so that their's don't get messed with.

    Right player - right price. If the cost of the exclusive franchise tag is losing Ellerbe, Boldin, Jacoby and/or a starting caliber LT, it is too steep a price.
    Let's take this one step at a time. First, it might be unwise to compare a WR or CB to a Super Bowl MVP QB. Second, teams have given up two first round picks for lesser talent/unproven talent. Third, look at how long it took the Ravens to start building the offense around Flacco and not around this 'Run the ball, rely on the defense' philosophy. It wasn't until then, basically after Cam got fired, that the team went on this run, with Joe leading the way. I would challenge you (in a friendly way) to explain how Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers has taken a team with lesser talent than the 2012 Ravens, and won the Super Bowl.

    Personally, from my perspective, none of them have done it. Brady's defenses were some of the best in the league the year he won the Super Bowl and his offensive lines have always been superb. Once their defense weakened, they still made the playoffs, but they don't have any rings to show for it. The one year that Indianapolis won the Super Bowl, Peyton Manning had a poor individual postseason. He threw three interceptions against Kansas City, two against Baltimore and didn't even score a single TD in that game. Their defense stepped up big time with that pass rush and Tampa 2 scheme. Drew Brees had the best Guard tandem in the league, and often had a clean pocket to step up into. Aaron Rodgers had a pretty good defense of his own, along with Greg Jennings and Donald Driver.

    Next, there's nothing to say that the team signing Flacco won't be able to build around him. Lastly, even at a favorable price for the organization, those guys that you mentioned are still at risk. Even if Flacco signs for a few million per year less than what he could get from them, it doesn't change that Jacoby Jones' cap number is 4.9, which is a lot for a returner/third WR. Leach's number is sizable as well. That few million won't change the fact that some of these guys are gone.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  8. #23
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by pslholder96 View Post
    And the cost of losing a franchise type QB we've been looking for all these years is not steeper??
    That too.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  9. #24
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    I think that what people fail to realize about the Browns is that they wouldn't just have to top our offer, they would have to crush our offer. Who in their right minds would walk away from a Super Bowl team with potential Pro Bowlers at every offensive position to get crushed on a weekly basis, and not sniff the play-offs from an extra million or two ayear. I'd say that it would have be $25-26 million per year for Flacco to think about it. Would a team be willing to pay that much and give up 2 first rounders?




  10. #25

    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coastergenius View Post
    I think that what people fail to realize about the Browns is that they wouldn't just have to top our offer, they would have to crush our offer. Who in their right minds would walk away from a Super Bowl team with potential Pro Bowlers at every offensive position to get crushed on a weekly basis, and not sniff the play-offs from an extra million or two ayear. I'd say that it would have be $25-26 million per year for Flacco to think about it. Would a team be willing to pay that much and give up 2 first rounders?
    The Browns are a lot closer than you give them credit for.

    Their defense is young and full of playmakers. They have a young bruising RB and a very good o line with a premier LT. Rob Chudzinski is a creative offensive mind that made Derek Anderson look good.

    Their downfall last year was no QB and no real receiving threat. Joe and Mike solve that and I guarantee that Mike Wallace would set records catching the most TD's over 60 yards in 1 season.

    If they add Joe and Mike Wallace that team probably wins the division and is a real contender going into 2014.

    It's worth giving up fort knox to secure a QB that could lead you to a title in 2 years. The people in Cleveland would erect a statue for Joe in 2015.




  11. #26
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coastergenius View Post
    I think that what people fail to realize about the Browns is that they wouldn't just have to top our offer, they would have to crush our offer. Who in their right minds would walk away from a Super Bowl team with potential Pro Bowlers at every offensive position to get crushed on a weekly basis, and not sniff the play-offs from an extra million or two ayear. I'd say that it would have be $25-26 million per year for Flacco to think about it. Would a team be willing to pay that much and give up 2 first rounders?
    Cleveland has the money to do it and add some weapons around him. Their offensive line is already good. Their RB is good. They need some WRs, but would have the money to get them. I could just as easily ask why the Ravens wouldn't pay Flacco 20 million per year after the run he just had an all that he's proven, even while having to deal with Cam Cameron.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  12. #27
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    Did people forget the Giants game where McKinnie wasn't playing, but Flacco still lit up the Giants?
    The Giants appeared to be in the midst of one of their seasonal "give up" modes that game. Their defense was horrid down the stretch. I get your point however.




  13. #28
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by LukeDaniel View Post
    The Giants appeared to be in the midst of one of their seasonal "give up" modes that game. Their defense was horrid down the stretch. I get your point however.
    They still had a good d-line. Pierre-paul is an elite pass rusher.




  14. #29
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    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    Go ahead and put that man out there, and watch what happens. You'd never get another front office job again. We are only thinking about Cleveland.

    Think about how many teams would want Flacco, first off:

    Buffalo
    Miami
    New York
    Cleveland
    Jacksonville
    Tennessee
    Kansas City
    Oakland
    Arizona

    Then, look at how many of them would have the money to sign Flacco

    Then, look at how many would be able to add a piece or two around him.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  15. #30

    Re: Exclusive or Non-Exclusive Franchise Tag for Flacco?

    The Browns with Joe Flacco win 14 games next year, while the Ravens without him would likely be looking for their 3rd or 4th win come December.

    It's not complicated. Put the non-exclusive tag on him and at BEST you'll have 6 or 8 teams lined up to make offers, and you'll allow THEM to set the terms of the contract that you supposedly want to sign Flacco to anyway. I'm sure Ozzie would LOVE farming his contract negotiation out to Arizona, Cleveland, or Jacksonville and then signing the offer sheet they put together--if he can. At worst, if they put the tag on Joe March 4th, he's gone, baby, gone 12:01 AM March 5th and the Ravens get to go into 2013 with Geno or Alex Smith at QB.

    If it has to be the tag at all, the Ravens are sunk anyway. I think it's preferable for them to simply fold and sign whatever contract Joe's agent puts in front of them. They have no one but themselves to blame.




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