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  1. #16

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?



    With the rules the way they are, you will never see a dominant defense like we have been accustomed to. Look at the 49ers 1st TD in the SB. I am convinced that Pollard pulled up instead of doing what his instincts were which was to blow Crabtree up. He pulled up and Crabtree bounced off and walked in to the end zone. That is what defense has to do now. They have to second guess and "adjust their style of play". This is what we are going to have to deal with now. There will be no truly dominant defense played in the NFL, scoring is too important to money generation.




  2. #17

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Yes, fans will most certainly miss this team having an elite defense. The good defenses this team has fielded would go down as other teams best ever, the elite defense that this team has fielded have gone down in history. For the last 17 years when one has said Baltimore the first thought has been defense. I feel many are disappointed or saddened by this thought. Whether it be the transition of the NfL or the retirement of the face of the elite Baltimore defense many will still relish the days of 2006 and 2000. This past season is an anomaly, injuries played a part but for the first time in a long time the personnel or lack there of was the problem. The young players that were thrown into the fire will only benefit from their experience, and with the promise from our own glorious wizard that deficiencies will be fixed I personally am excited about the future. We may no longer be elite by our own standards, but we are still damn good enough to win a Lombardi and we proved that. This team is balanced with the offense taking over and I am okay with that. Many will struggle with the lack of elite defense in Baltimore, but we set the bar from the beginning. This was truly the end of an era but it ended in the best way possible




  3. #18

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by HKusp View Post
    With the rules the way they are, you will never see a dominant defense like we have been accustomed to. Look at the 49ers 1st TD in the SB. I am convinced that Pollard pulled up instead of doing what his instincts were which was to blow Crabtree up. He pulled up and Crabtree bounced off and walked in to the end zone. That is what defense has to do now. They have to second guess and "adjust their style of play". This is what we are going to have to deal with now. There will be no truly dominant defense played in the NFL, scoring is too important to money generation.
    Didn't Pollard have like 6 broken ribs at that point?




  4. #19
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    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by HKusp View Post
    With the rules the way they are, you will never see a dominant defense like we have been accustomed to. Look at the 49ers 1st TD in the SB. I am convinced that Pollard pulled up instead of doing what his instincts were which was to blow Crabtree up. He pulled up and Crabtree bounced off and walked in to the end zone. That is what defense has to do now. They have to second guess and "adjust their style of play". This is what we are going to have to deal with now. There will be no truly dominant defense played in the NFL, scoring is too important to money generation.
    I'm guessing Pollard pulling up on that first TD had way more to do with the fact that he busted up 4 to 6 ribs on the first play of the game. Otherwise Pollard would have brought the wood like he's done all season.




  5. #20

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Elite defense doesn't mean squat anymore because they can't lay the wood. Goodell has turned this into a passing league. The Ravens, for all the yards they gave up, were still pretty good in points allowed and red zone defense. We put up 30+ points on the #2 and #3 defense in the league in the PLAYOFFS. This is the new NFL, that is how it is done.




  6. #21

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    I miss it but in today's NFL defense doesn't win Championships anymore. You still need a good defense but it's more important to have a top QB with offensive weapons.
    I do not know if that ever was the case, but it really has not changed. We were talking about the 49r dynasty squad and just how dominant the D was even though Joe and the O got most of the glory. The Dallas dynasty had a nasty defense as well. The Steelers have 2 rings recently with a top defense helping a franchise QB. The Giants did not have a top regular season D, but were getting after elite QBs like crazy on the SB runs. The Pats have not won it all since they downgraded on defense (and got caught cheating). The Superbaugh this year had the teams with the best defenses going at it. Defenses that fell apart almost instantly when the elite DL got hurt.

    For a while the trend was going to spread pass attacks and away from the run. Now the trend the sprint option, and teams that are not equipt to stop the run with basically just the DL and ILBs, are getting gashed wide open.

    So defensively the #1 need IMO is a nose tackle and DL talent/ depth. We can find ilbs. Our projected starters Ellerbe and McClain were udfas. I think the pass D is in good shape with Webb getting back into the mix and Suggs hopefully bouncing back to form. I think we can draft or pick up a cheap vet to replace Kruger as the 3rd down rush specialist. The edges of our D are pretty well stocked and should not be tough to fortify. Up the middle does need a big influx of new talent and size to take on the run game and the huge TE passing threats.
    Last edited by Jeremiah W; 02-10-2013 at 12:45 PM.







  7. #22
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    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    I'll take the Championship without the great D, as others have stated. Rule changes, losing top talent, injuries, they all add to the demise of the defense.

    Pitt had the #1 D and only won 8 games... the league has changed. Defense wins championships in college, not pros
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  8. #23

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by cbaywolf View Post
    I'm guessing Pollard pulling up on that first TD had way more to do with the fact that he busted up 4 to 6 ribs on the first play of the game. Otherwise Pollard would have brought the wood like he's done all season.
    Yes I kept waiting for it but never came. Now we know why but dam is that not impressive? Taking playing like a Raven to a new level. We don't need a great defense just good one. Suggs & Mcphee should be healthy and Upshaw and Arthur Jones will step up in their 2nd year. Ellerbe will have to take over for Ray and hopefully we can get decent picks at LB and safety and maybe find a nose tackle as a FA.




  9. #24

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle View Post
    I'll take the Championship without the great D, as others have stated. Rule changes, losing top talent, injuries, they all add to the demise of the defense.

    Pitt had the #1 D and only won 8 games... the league has changed. Defense wins championships in college, not pros
    SF and the Ravens have been right there 2 years in a row with teams built and heavily invested in the defense. The teams that have won the SB recently or got there either had a good defense, or played a lot of good defense in the playoffs. The Cards coming up with a lot of turnovers or Indy getting Bob Sanders back or just playing above the talent against us.

    The Ravens, Steelers in 06 and Tampa were the only teams recently that were suspect on O but strong enough on D to get the job done. So it mostly takes balance, not dominance in one area, but defense is still a big factor in who wins the championship. Our D played lights out in the second alf in NE and 1st half of the SB, and all along the way in the playoffs, or we would not have this championship.







  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremiah W View Post
    SF and the Ravens have been right there 2 years in a row with teams built and heavily invested in the defense. The teams that have won the SB recently or got there either had a good defense, or played a lot of good defense in the playoffs. The Cards coming up with a lot of turnovers or Indy getting Bob Sanders back or just playing above the talent against us.

    The Ravens, Steelers in 06 and Tampa were the only teams recently that were suspect on O but strong enough on D to get the job done. So it mostly takes balance, not dominance in one area, but defense is still a big factor in who wins the championship. Our D played lights out in the second alf in NE and 1st half of the SB, and all along the way in the playoffs, or we would not have this championship.
    Yep. Just ask the Pats.
    “Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.”

    –Eleanor Roosevelt




  11. #26

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    I miss not having an elite run defense anymore. It has been frustrating to watch. I hope we can fortify that over the offseason.




  12. #27

    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raving Sports Fan View Post
    Yes I kept waiting for it but never came. Now we know why but dam is that not impressive? Taking playing like a Raven to a new level. We don't need a great defense just good one. Suggs & Mcphee should be healthy and Upshaw and Arthur Jones will step up in their 2nd year. Ellerbe will have to take over for Ray and hopefully we can get decent picks at LB and safety and maybe find a nose tackle as a FA.
    Arthur Jones will be in his 3rd year. This is the first I have heard of Pollard having broken his ribs during the Superbowl. That being said, my point still stands, these guys are second guessing when hitting because of the new rules. It is how a slug like Byron Leftwich can run 20+ yards down the sideline and score a TD. 5 years ago he would have been blown out of his cleats on that sideline run. Not now.




  13. #28
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    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    Just some random thoughts/comments--

    > I agree, I'd rather have Betty than a "pretty" D.

    > IMHO, there's a difference between a "stout" or "elite" defense [and insert ad here for "Please define 'elite'!] and what the Ravens defense did in the 2000-2001 season and post-season. I've watched football on my radio until they invented TV, and then on my 100' HDTV for over 60 years now, and the performance of that defense was nothing short of unbelievable! I told folks back then that if the season had gone another 20 weeks, the Ravens would have continued to win every week regardless of who they played. I don't think we'll get to see such a performance again.

    > Consider that the CAP allows teams to make choices - where do I want to spend $$$, and how? There is a school of thought that says that you can have a good overall team, but you spend on one side of the ball or the other, and pragmatically you cannot spend on both. I sorta kinda tend to agree with that. Thus, elevating the Ravens offense to a more fromidable entity was basically done at the expense of the defense. If you agree with this, the question really becomes - which one do you want, cuz ya can't have both.

    > I'm recalling discussions and threads from post SB XXXV. There was a definite recognition that the offense needed an upgrade - Dilfer was a game manager, not a team/offense leader or "team on my back" carrier"; the receivers were having issues catching a cold, much less the ball; the offensive line needed a new rusty gate at RT, Edwin's knees were deteriorating, Mitchell was going to jump ship at center, and so forth;

    but the defense would carry us to multiple Super Bowls -- EXCEPT that Sharper would get swiped by the new Houston team, and Starks would leave for Ariz, and McCrary and Burnett were walking wounded, and Herring left, and...

    we ended up with a "better" offense, and a "not as good" defense, and a 2 and done playoff result.

    Consider that Jamal gets hurt, Searcy tears a tricep, Grbac is a pussy, etc. I guess the reason I mention all of this is to say that, where could Ozzie have made changes with the CAP limits to enhance both sides of the ball and get a better result? I honestly don't know




  14. #29
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    Re: Do you miss having an elite defense?

    To answer the question about the drop off in run defense, the two main problems is Kemo and Cody, they aren't good players, you need a good NT to help out in run defense, it all starts on him. If you forget about the first cople of weeks of the regular season, the edge run defending was pretty good all year. Most the runs against us were up the middle. That is why we need an upgrade at NT.

    The pass rush was actually pretty good towards the end of the year, but we were without a healthy elite pass rusher all year. The pass defense is pretty damn good, but because of the lack of pass rush, the pass defense got exposed a little. It all starts with the run though, and has a domino effect if you cant stop it.




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