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  1. #61

    Re: How we should attack the Patriots



    Brady doesn't have Manning's quickness at getting rid of the ball, though he's no slouch in reading defenses and getting off a quick pass. Pressure from the edges does work against Brady moreso than Manning, however. We saw that last year with Suggs, and JJ Watt had a few good pressures that helped the Texans at least make it a respectable game.

    Pressure up the middle would still be great, of course, but it's not as essential as it was against Manning.

    If the divisional round is something to go by, Bellichek wants his DB's to press and stay close to the receivers. They weren't giving up any short passes. Caldwell should be able to make some money with max protect schemes and getting Smith and/or Jones down the field. I suspect the Patriots will roll coverage to try and take Boldin away, but Smith's performance against Bailey could cause them to rethink that. Smith and Jones can outrun the coverage, especially if the safeties creep up to help out in short and medium routes and the run game, but that only works if Flacco has time to throw. The blocking needs to soak up the rush or give Flacco a lane out of the pocket to extend the play. I think they can do it. If they could do it against the better pass rush of the Broncos, they should be able to do it against the Patriots. I don't care what their defense is ranked, however. They were crap last year, but played the Ravens tough in the AFCCG. Wilfork looked like a man among boys at times, and they have even more beef along the front than they did last year.

    This game is more on the offense, however. In times past, all we wanted from the Ravens offense is to help out in the field position battle and to make money on the opportunities the defense gave them. This year, we need the defense to come up with enough to help the offense outscore the Patriots. Special Teams needs to right the ship, too.

    As with the Bronco game, I don't think they need to play a perfect game. They can make mistakes and overcome them, but part of that is getting the Patriots to make mistakes, too. The fumbled exchange between Birk and Flacco and the two kick returns were offset by Manning's three turnovers. The Ravens don't have to play mistake free, but they can't afford to lose the turnover battle, either.




  2. #62
    SuggsKill Guest

    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    We're going to have to have a balanced offense. We need to get Rice involved early and start punishing their defense. I can't wait until we start destroying Brady on all fronts.




  3. #63

    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by bacchys View Post
    Brady doesn't have Manning's quickness at getting rid of the ball, though he's no slouch in reading defenses and getting off a quick pass. Pressure from the edges does work against Brady moreso than Manning, however. We saw that last year with Suggs, and JJ Watt had a few good pressures that helped the Texans at least make it a respectable game.

    Pressure up the middle would still be great, of course, but it's not as essential as it was against Manning.

    If the divisional round is something to go by, Bellichek wants his DB's to press and stay close to the receivers. They weren't giving up any short passes. Caldwell should be able to make some money with max protect schemes and getting Smith and/or Jones down the field. I suspect the Patriots will roll coverage to try and take Boldin away, but Smith's performance against Bailey could cause them to rethink that. Smith and Jones can outrun the coverage, especially if the safeties creep up to help out in short and medium routes and the run game, but that only works if Flacco has time to throw. The blocking needs to soak up the rush or give Flacco a lane out of the pocket to extend the play. I think they can do it. If they could do it against the better pass rush of the Broncos, they should be able to do it against the Patriots. I don't care what their defense is ranked, however. They were crap last year, but played the Ravens tough in the AFCCG. Wilfork looked like a man among boys at times, and they have even more beef along the front than they did last year.

    This game is more on the offense, however. In times past, all we wanted from the Ravens offense is to help out in the field position battle and to make money on the opportunities the defense gave them. This year, we need the defense to come up with enough to help the offense outscore the Patriots. Special Teams needs to right the ship, too.

    As with the Bronco game, I don't think they need to play a perfect game. They can make mistakes and overcome them, but part of that is getting the Patriots to make mistakes, too. The fumbled exchange between Birk and Flacco and the two kick returns were offset by Manning's three turnovers. The Ravens don't have to play mistake free, but they can't afford to lose the turnover battle, either.
    Good observation. Brady also doesnt have the SIZE of recievers (TE & WR) that Manning had either, with Gronk gone. Decker, Tamme, Thomas and Dreissen are all big targets. Stokely is alot like Welker. Brady will have to be more precise with his passes and is scared of Ed Reed, cause he cant predict what Reed will do. The Patriots really dont have a deep ball guy, which helps the Ravens play the seams tighter. I think NE gets is 20 something points, but that should put the Ravens in the game. Ravens/Pats games are ALWAYS close. I dont see NE getting much of a pass rush without blitzing. While the Ravens have been getting a decent rush past 3 games vs NYG, INDY and Denver. Ravens should score thier points also. Kicking game will be interesting, especially with the wind that is expected Sunday 22mph (too far out to really call actual accurate wind speeds) Its nice to have have Jacoby Jones returning kicks.




  4. #64
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by Boulderraven View Post
    Good observation. Brady also doesnt have the SIZE of recievers (TE & WR) that Manning had either, with Gronk gone. Decker, Tamme, Thomas and Dreissen are all big targets. Stokely is alot like Welker. Brady will have to be more precise with his passes and is scared of Ed Reed, cause he cant predict what Reed will do. The Patriots really dont have a deep ball guy, which helps the Ravens play the seams tighter. I think NE gets is 20 something points, but that should put the Ravens in the game. Ravens/Pats games are ALWAYS close. I dont see NE getting much of a pass rush without blitzing. While the Ravens have been getting a decent rush past 3 games vs NYG, INDY and Denver. Ravens should score thier points also. Kicking game will be interesting, especially with the wind that is expected Sunday 22mph (too far out to really call actual accurate wind speeds) Its nice to have have Jacoby Jones returning kicks.
    Quickly share the WEEI comments been hearing this AM, same as I heard last night....Summary is Flacco is awesome and proven he can beat them, but Raven's D with all the travel, harsh weather, age, emotions, and shear number of snaps, 87 in Denver, will finally break down in the early 3rd Q. Brady will stay in the hurry-up no huddle and gas the D forcing Flacco to keep it the air and it may be close at the half but a 2nd half blowout.




  5. #65

    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    all the travel, harsh weather, age, emotions, and shear number of snaps, 87 in Denver

    There is certainly a possibility that the Ravens could collapse because they are drained, but this is another example of the media not understanding the makeup of the situation.

    The Ravens essentially got a bye week three weeks ago when they didn't play their players against Cincy. They also have an extra day of rest prior to the AFCC, and an added advantage with it being a night game. Essentially, it's as if they are playing on a Monday night, if we were to draw a comparison between regular season schedules.

    If this was a regular season setup between a 3-4 week stretch, wouldn't they also be tired from all of the snaps? I understand there is a cumulative effect in the postseason, but I just don't see it being that much more demanding for the Ravens than anyone else at this point.

    As for the age factor... we've obviously dispelled that myth, and clearly the talking heads just want to harp on the age issue.




  6. #66
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by sopranocorleone View Post
    all the travel, harsh weather, age, emotions, and shear number of snaps, 87 in Denver

    There is certainly a possibility that the Ravens could collapse because they are drained, but this is another example of the media not understanding the makeup of the situation.

    The Ravens essentially got a bye week three weeks ago when they didn't play their players against Cincy. They also have an extra day of rest prior to the AFCC, and an added advantage with it being a night game. Essentially, it's as if they are playing on a Monday night, if we were to draw a comparison between regular season schedules.

    If this was a regular season setup between a 3-4 week stretch, wouldn't they also be tired from all of the snaps? I understand there is a cumulative effect in the postseason, but I just don't see it being that much more demanding for the Ravens than anyone else at this point.

    As for the age factor... we've obviously dispelled that myth, and clearly the talking heads just want to harp on the age issue.
    The number of snaps is way blown out of proportion. Really it comes down to mental toughness which I think the Ravens have plenty of.




  7. #67
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    The number of snaps is way blown out of proportion. Really it comes down to mental toughness which I think the Ravens have plenty of.
    It is way over blown. These are would class athletes who go through hours and hours of recovery exercises every day, massages, ice baths, recovery foods, you name it. If anything, this game probably helped our players conditioning levels. The defense will be coming off a huge work load in Denver, but with an extra day of rest, as well as resting on Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday, they will be in better physical condition and will be prepared to defend against a somewhat similar offense. Our team went through hell at that altitude level, so they should be ready for a nice little trip up to Boston to play on a turfed pitch which is very similar to playing on M and T's turf. The Foxboro crowd isn't exactly "loud" either.




  8. #68
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    It is way over blown. These are would class athletes who go through hours and hours of recovery exercises every day, massages, ice baths, recovery foods, you name it. If anything, this game probably helped our players conditioning levels. The defense will be coming off a huge work load in Denver, but with an extra day of rest, as well as resting on Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday, they will be in better physical condition and will be prepared to defend against a somewhat similar offense. Our team went through hell at that altitude level, so they should be ready for a nice little trip up to Boston to play on a turfed pitch which is very similar to playing on M and T's turf. The Foxboro crowd isn't exactly "loud" either.
    My thoughts exactly. They played 5+ quarters at 5280 feet. It will seem easy coming down to sea level this week.




  9. #69
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    One thing that is clear when you watch the Patriots is that their defensive backs cover aggressively. Flacco needs to get the ball to Boldin when he in single coverage even if he looks covered. Boldin has the ability to break right though that coverage. If he's singled he's open.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  10. #70
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    One thing that is clear when you watch the Patriots is that their defensive backs cover aggressively. Flacco needs to get the ball to Boldin when he in single coverage even if he looks covered. Boldin has the ability to break right though that coverage. If he's singled he's open.
    Great point.




  11. #71
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    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    One thing that is clear when you watch the Patriots is that their defensive backs cover aggressively. Flacco needs to get the ball to Boldin when he in single coverage even if he looks covered. Boldin has the ability to break right though that coverage. If he's singled he's open.
    Two words...pump fake.

    As for the "tired D" issue, that can be helped if Caldwell continues to run the ball with Rice/Pierce, sustaining long drives for scores and keeping the defense off the field. Considering we were able to put up 131 on Denver's stout run D, I honestly think we'll be able to at least put up that much against NE.




  12. #72

    Re: How we should attack the Patriots

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    I've re-watched the Houston/Patriots game a couple of times and taken some notes on what I saw.

    - The Patriots have a very very good offensive line, and can give Brady all day to throw, they aren't bad as a run blocking unit either. They are all tall athletic players who can get to the second level and do their jobs very well.
    Good observation on the Run blocking. That is something many folks miss. They tend to think the Pats still run strictly out of the zone and they are not a power run team. When the truth is they are both, and they are very good in the power run game, especially with Ridley who is a very patient runner. Both Vollmer and Solder are really good at getting to the to the second level from the backside on runs.

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    - The Patriots really don't have a deep threat element at all, but this is nothing new, they haven't had that since Randy Moss left. They are going to be pretty much the same offense we seen from Denver, just not as physical at WR, their receivers are much smaller. They will likely run the ball a ton like Denver did too, but unlike at wide out, their running game is much more physical than Denvers running scheme. The Patriots seem to run a variant of the power run scheme and the ZBS. The Patriots will likely be quicker to the snap than Denver were against us, so we must be prepared to deal with that.
    The Pats will go fast when it suits them. It will depend on your personnel package in the game at the time. If the Pats feel they have something they think they can exploit and they want to keep that matchup on the field they will go right into the hurry up. I agree we don't have a big lengthy deep threat WR, but Lloyd can get behind defenses. But for the most part the Pats are good at manufacturing deep balls. A good example would be splitting Vereen out wide on a LB and winning the speed battle essentially "creating" a deep threat. But yes, the Pats don't have a person that would be considered a true deep threat play in and play out.

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    - On defense the Patriots are big and physical up front, they have a large front 7, their LB's actually look more like D linemen with their size. Their secondary can tackle well, they come up and attack, similar to how Pittsburgh play, just not as good. They are still a liability in coverage, and we will need to throw a lot of deep ones like against Denver.
    Mayo has been better in coverage, but still has an issue finding and playing the ball in pass coverage. Hightower is deceptive in coverage, but is susceptible to read errors especially play action. Spikes is not a guy the Pats want trailing dudes around the field in coverage. I think the Pats will use more of Tracy White in this game because of the coverage issue. Unless Belichick and company are not scared of Flacco beating them underneath.

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    -The Patriots pass rush doesn't really scare me at all, they don't have any scary edge rushers, and certainly no where near the level of what Denver offered. If Oher and McKinnie play as well as they did in Denver, the Patriots wont have much of an impact off the edges. The rookie Chandler Jones has a lot of talent and can make plays, but he still appears to be fairly raw as an every down player.
    Denver didn't appear to blitz you guys very often. I think Belichick and Patricia will blitz Flacco quit a bit. Jones has not been the same since his ankle injury. The Pats are hot and cold when it comes to QB pressure, especially off the edge. But I think the Pats are going to do everything to bring pressure right up the middle and make Flacco roll out, especially to his left. Hightower and Spikes are good at disguising their blitzes, but again I am not sure how many snaps Spikes gets in this game. I think White will get a lot of time at MLB spying Rice out of the backfield. And don't sleep on Ninkovich a very underrated player on our defense.

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    - It is more the interior line of that defense that worries me, lead by Wilfolk, who as we all know is their best player on D and gave us fits last year. Birk is going to have to do a better job this time around, but I'm sure KO and Yanda will give him plenty of help, our Oline is much more physical and larger with KO playing guard and McKinnie at LT now. I'm not sure if there's a bigger Oline pound for pound when we have our current line up there.
    One difference, and you pointed it out earlier, is the size and physicality of our ends. Dumervil and Miller are smaller speed guys, actually the Broncos front 7 as a whole is on the smaller side. I an interested to see how Mckinnee does against big strong physical ends, it is clear he can handle speed guys after playing the Colts and Broncos. But can he handle Jones' length, strength and speed (if Jones is healthy of course, practiced yesterday but reinjured his ankle on Sunday) or the power and burst of Francis. I'm not a fan of Oher at all and I think he will have his hands full with Ninkovich. The real question is how does your interior line handle Wilfork and Deaderick and in rotation Love? I think this is where a lot of the game will be won and lost in this game for the Ravens. If they can keep the tubbies out of the back field or Flacco face it will make life very tough on the Pats. But if they are getting to Flacco moving him around in the pocket etc...I think Flacco ends up throwing a couple of picks.

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    What my gameplan would be:

    - Their Oline is very effective, so Kruger and Suggs are going to have to be on top of their game, and Ngata has to push the pile up the middle. I would go to mostly a 4-3 base defense like we did last year. Have Kruger play LDE rotating with Upshaw, and Suggs play RDE, with Ngata and McPhee/A Jones on the inside. Have Ray and Ellerbe as the LB's, and Pollard should come in as the weakside LB dropping back into coverage covering Hernandez, and play Chykie Brown as the nikel corner and Ihedigbo at SS. There is no Grontkowski to worry about in this one. We are going to get nikel and dimed all up and down the park, so it's vital that our front 4 can create some pressure. We did a good job against a similar front @Denver, we were creating pressure with only 3 men at times, so hopefully it will be the same here.

    - Stop the run, and you will stop Brady and the offense. We stepped up against the run against the Broncos, and we must do the same here. You would scratch your head at this one, but this years Patriots team has a very effective running game that is quick to the snap and is really hard to defend, we must make sure that Ridley has no room to run. If Brady is forced to throw the ball around, and we get after him, he doesn't like it. History shows that if you pressure Brady, he starts to crumble.

    - On offense, use zone stretch plays. Arian Foster had somenice runs around the edges against the Patriots, but not many up the middle. Again this defense is built up the middle, and Wilfolk makes it very hard for the interior of the Oline. Hopefully Pierce can go for this one, as he's a very effective zone runner, and the Patriots are poor at setting the edge from what I seen.

    - Throw over the middle, and take a significant amount of deep shots. The Patriots weakness on defense lies mostly through the middle in the passing game. Their big LB's can't cover that well, and their safeties are average. Shaubb at some success throwing down the middle last night. I think we could do a job with Pitta and Boldin excelling around that area. Then take the deep shots with Torrey and Jacoby. The Patriots are still not very good at defending the deep shots.

    - No stupid penalties, fuck ups, silly drops in clutch moments, or ST fuck ups. I'm confident we can win this game if everyone does their job and avoid making boneheaded plays. We lost last year because of a stupid lack of concentration by Lee Evans, and a gigantic fuck up by Billy Cundiff. I don't expect Tucker to make the same mistake, but lets try and avoid the kicking to tie or win the game for once. Lets try and make this an outright win that isn't forced to OT, so I don't gain increased blood pressure.

    I'm fully confident we can win this, but its going to be a very hard game, and I expect this game to be just as hard as the Denver game- maybe not as physically demanding due to the altitude and having to play 6 quarters of football.
    The safeties are above average in speed and coverage. They lack that intimidation factor, but Gregory has been very solid and McCourtey has been really good on the back end. Talib has solidified that secondary along with rookie Dennard and Arrington has been good in the slot.

    I think you have to go to Boldin over the middle, he won't beat the Pats deep. But the key will be Pitta and Dickson, they both have to have big days other wise you guys won't move the chains enough to win. Smith won't be running free down the sideline this week, Belichick isn't dumb enough to leave Talib in Man 0 coverage on him. There will be a safety over Smith at all times. Also Smith isn't that much faster than Talib and McCourtey is faster than Smith. Champ is not what he once was and has lost a step or two. Denver was idiotic to leave him alone. Jones on a fly makes me nervous and when he is in the game on the outside will force us to play cover 2 on top.

    I don't think Rice has a big game, if he does we are in trouble because the Pats will sell out on him both in the run game and the pass game. They will do everything they can to make Flacco beat them by being consistant in the short to intermediate passing game.




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