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  1. #16

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room



    I'm okay with a little bit of restructuring but nothing significant because too much restructuring is just an indictment of how bad the contract was structured to begin with. Something you can't accuse the ravens of too often. I think we'll be able to sustain our winning ways by drafting better and cutting loose aging veterans. Something the ravens have not been shy about over the last couple of years.




  2. #17

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    100% true

    Didn't the Ravens just restructure Yanda this offseason? That was an attempt to free up some room because Rice's tag was killing them in free agency. I can't see them doing to much of it since it really does just keep pushing things down the line until you can't push them anymore. More likely they'll make some cuts to get a little more space.
    Yanda was just restructured this past off season so I don't see it.

    In addition restructuring deals is what's killing the Steelers. I think the Ravens will say goodbye to some veterans ala last year and count on the young guys they draft and are already here to be at least serviceable (speaking of young guys look for Adrian Hamilton to have a sack or 2 as well as a FF on Sunday.....I just have a gut feeling).

    Even with those changes the Ravens should be in good shape to win the division for a third year in a row because the Steelers are about to really pay the piper and the Bengals simply never push themselves over the hump with a key FA signing (ie another real receiver to compliment AJ Green) even though they have plenty of cap space. The Browns will be rebuilding yet again.




  3. #18

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by Benny8444 View Post
    We are not the team from Western PA, THe one that always restructures deals and is in cap trouble every year and now cought up to the point where they have to make A LOT of cuts.
    What cuts will they have make they would not make in any event? The Steelers were 20 plus million over the cap last year. With restructures they are 15 million over this year. The cap was flat.

    Who did they not sign to extensions that was prevented by the cap? Regardless of their cap figures, they were not going to give Wallace Fitzgerald money.

    They will cut the veterans they were going to cut all along this year. By next year they will have a nice chunk of money under the cap.




  4. #19

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...eate-cap-room/

    The Bucs did it. Why can't the Ravens? Everyone on here seems hellbent that paying Flacco is going to kill the cap. Well, the Bucs just cleared off nearly $20 mill against next year's cap by restructuring VJax's deal and Carl Nicks' deal...and they JUST signed those deals a year ago.

    I'm not saying that the Bucs and the Ravens are in the same boat, they're not, but this just goes to show you that there are ways to move money around so as not to kill the cap next year and still remain competitive in 2013 and in the future.

    Ngata, Rice, Suggs, Boldin, Jacoby, Webb, and even McClain could all have their current deals restructured in some way (Ravor may have more insight into this) to make cap room.
    Bucs were able to do it now because they still had a huge amount of money under the cap for 2012. You have to have the room under the current cap year to do this. The Raven's do not.




  5. #20

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by Benny8444 View Post
    We are not the team from Western PA, THe one that always restructures deals and is in cap trouble every year and now cought up to the point where they have to make A LOT of cuts.

    We may re do one or two but thats it. The Ravens dont like doing this and by having Ray/Boldin take a pay cut it would make this a non issue as would signing Flacco.

    If they re did one contract to prorate over a long term It would be Ngata or Suggs. Webb wont get touched for at least a couple of years.
    i think its called Pissburg.




  6. #21
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    If we're going to restructure any contracts it will be Suggs, and it will only be by like 2 odd million. Every little helps for us, and they will structure at least one contract in the offseason, but most of the cap savings will come from cuts/retirements, or contract extensions.




  7. #22
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    I'd have to imagine Boldin gets cut, not restructured. It sucks to say since he's such a likable guy and prototypical Raven, but if it happened to Mason and Heap at similar points in their career I don't see why Boldin would be exempted. I'd also think Birk would be a possible cap casualty if the coaches have faith in Gradkowski.

    Jacoby Jones is a prime candidate for a restructure, similar to the deal that Pollard got this offseason.

    The really fascinating issue, and the elephant in the room, is what happens to 52. All objective evidence and logic would lead to him getting cut but how do you cut the guy who's been the heart and soul of the franchise since day 1?




  8. #23

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    The Bucs are set up completely different and some of those contracts are unlike any of of ours.

    They have had so much cap room that neither Nicks nor Jackson had ANY signing bonus. And even with the restructure, they just converted money into a roster bonus.

    Essentially, they can cut Nicks or Jackson at any point they want, and have ZERO cap hit.

    As for us, we have never had the cap room to do what they did and we all know they don't want to restructure because you are just pushing money into the future...essentially what the Steelers did and are doing and why they are going to be probably $20-30 million over next years cap.

    And frankly, I agree with it. To me, it makes no sense to restructure any time you want...especially players over 30. No way would I restructure guys like Suggs and Boldin. Frankly, until he shows he can stay healthy and play at a high level again for a full season, I wouldn't restructure Ngata either. I'd maybe do Webbie, but he'd have to really work with us due to his injury history. And why would I restructure McClain? He needs a pay cut, or cut all together IMHO. Maybe Yanda, but he was already restructured last year and I don't know how many times I'd want to do so.

    IMHO, the team should have used things like roster bonuses earlier instead of these extremely large split bonuses.

    Going back to the original names...other than Jacoby and Rice, I wouldn't extend any of them.
    Last edited by Raveninwoodlawn; 12-28-2012 at 06:17 PM.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  9. #24
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by chicagoravensfan View Post
    I'd have to imagine Boldin gets cut, not restructured. It sucks to say since he's such a likable guy and prototypical Raven, but if it happened to Mason and Heap at similar points in their career I don't see why Boldin would be exempted. I'd also think Birk would be a possible cap casualty if the coaches have faith in Gradkowski.

    Jacoby Jones is a prime candidate for a restructure, similar to the deal that Pollard got this offseason.

    The really fascinating issue, and the elephant in the room, is what happens to 52. All objective evidence and logic would lead to him getting cut but how do you cut the guy who's been the heart and soul of the franchise since day 1?
    Boldin and Jones both have one year left on their deals. How is one a prime candidate and the other not? I'm not sure Quan at $6 million (since his 1.5 million dead money is already a sunk cost) is any worse of a value than Jacoby at $4 million (what we'd have to pay him assuming we pick up his $1 million roster bonus). Besides, both players are entering the final year of their deals, so I'm not sure how you can restructure those anyways, unless you somehow did an extension of a year and diverted some of the 2013 salary towards 2014. I think you are just worsening your situation by doing that, though.

    Also, I don't believe Pollard was restructured. I believe he was just given an extension. There is a big difference between the two. Pollard's original contract was a 2 year deal, so there would be no way to restructure before the final year of the contract (much like with Jacoby and Quan). When he signed with the Ravens it wasn't reworking the original contract, but rather adding an extension.



    How to handle Boldin seems to be a polarizing topic here. I think the Raven's best option is this (and this is far from my first time saying this). Bring Anquan in and explain to him that your intention is to cut him and, if possible, work out a cheaper extension with him when cut. Offer him $7.6 million over 2 years. Give him a $2 million signing bonus and $2.6 base salary in 2013 and a $3 million base salary in 2014.

    His 2013 Cap figure would be $5.1 million ($2.6 million+ 1 million prorated signing bonus+ 1.5 cap hit from his original signing bonus). Boldin is a valuable, consistent enough player that I think a $5.1 cap allocation makes sense...or at least at lot more than the $7.5 he is scheduled to count against our cap.

    His 2014 Cap Figure would be $4 million ($3 million base salary and $1 million prorated signing bonus). Boldin would be 34 early in the 2014 season, but I don't think this figure makes him too expensive to keep.

    From Boldin's standpoint, it makes sense as well. He gets to stay with a team that knows his talents well. Yes, he won't get his $6 million in salary, but he does get $4.6....$2 million of which he gets to pocket right away by signing his contract. He also has a contract for 2014 at a salary reasonable enough to think he will actually see the money.

    Any thoughts Ravor?

    Who has Ozzie and Biscuits email address....forward this to them! Keep Q!




  10. #25
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Yea i would like to see them extend either Q or Jones. Letting them both walk would put a serious dent in our wr corps. Id actually be cool with extending both of them. Its the best way to get those cap hits down.




  11. #26

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by LukeDaniel View Post
    Boldin and Jones both have one year left on their deals. How is one a prime candidate and the other not? I'm not sure Quan at $6 million (since his 1.5 million dead money is already a sunk cost) is any worse of a value than Jacoby at $4 million (what we'd have to pay him assuming we pick up his $1 million roster bonus). Besides, both players are entering the final year of their deals, so I'm not sure how you can restructure those anyways, unless you somehow did an extension of a year and diverted some of the 2013 salary towards 2014. I think you are just worsening your situation by doing that, though.

    Also, I don't believe Pollard was restructured. I believe he was just given an extension. There is a big difference between the two. Pollard's original contract was a 2 year deal, so there would be no way to restructure before the final year of the contract (much like with Jacoby and Quan). When he signed with the Ravens it wasn't reworking the original contract, but rather adding an extension.



    How to handle Boldin seems to be a polarizing topic here. I think the Raven's best option is this (and this is far from my first time saying this). Bring Anquan in and explain to him that your intention is to cut him and, if possible, work out a cheaper extension with him when cut. Offer him $7.6 million over 2 years. Give him a $2 million signing bonus and $2.6 base salary in 2013 and a $3 million base salary in 2014.

    His 2013 Cap figure would be $5.1 million ($2.6 million+ 1 million prorated signing bonus+ 1.5 cap hit from his original signing bonus). Boldin is a valuable, consistent enough player that I think a $5.1 cap allocation makes sense...or at least at lot more than the $7.5 he is scheduled to count against our cap.

    His 2014 Cap Figure would be $4 million ($3 million base salary and $1 million prorated signing bonus). Boldin would be 34 early in the 2014 season, but I don't think this figure makes him too expensive to keep.

    From Boldin's standpoint, it makes sense as well. He gets to stay with a team that knows his talents well. Yes, he won't get his $6 million in salary, but he does get $4.6....$2 million of which he gets to pocket right away by signing his contract. He also has a contract for 2014 at a salary reasonable enough to think he will actually see the money.

    Any thoughts Ravor?

    Who has Ozzie and Biscuits email address....forward this to them! Keep Q!
    Very well-thought out post. I think Boldin's future depends not only on his contract and cap hit, but also on how the team feels about the WR depth chart on the whole. Is Boldin worth, say, a 5.1m cap hit next year? Well, maybe, but everything is relative. Seeing the flashes Doss has shown this year and Torrey Smith's ability to take over games at time, perhaps they go into 2013 willing to bank on those two continuing to grow and evolve as their top 2 WRs.

    Jacoby Jones is the other factor here. He's been fantastic as a returner and made good contributions as the #3 WR. We know he won't be back next year on his current contract, but they could certainly renegotiate and extend. Is Jacoby more valuable to this team as a RS and #3 WR than Boldin as a #1 WR? Particularly considering they have Doss waiting in the wings to take over Boldin's role?

    Of the two, I think I'd prefer to have Jacoby back and draft a mid-round guy to round out the depth chart. Not only does that save money, it pushes our age at WR down substantially and gives Doss a chance, which IMO he's earned with his flashes this year.




  12. #27
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    B-more Ravor will probably be putting out a cap update in the next few months that will highlight some big contracts where restructuring or cutting will help big time.

    As far as restructuring, for the most part I'm not a fan. It's a move that screams more "the window is closing" than building a perennial contender. Some restructures are simple number moving and we tend to do those, but the ones that create immediate cap at the price of future caps is generally not a game we play. Ozzie still has nightmares of 2002, when he was forced to GUT the team because all those FA deals he made in 99, 2000, 2001 came back to bite him.

    That's why in 2010, you saw Heap, McGahee, Gregg, and Mason all get cut. I'm sure we could've restructured their deals, but it would've made these years where Rice and Flacco were up even WORSE.

    Look no further than Pitt, who is 28 mil over the cap BEFORE any deals.
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    “When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.


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  13. #28
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by LukeDaniel View Post
    Boldin and Jones both have one year left on their deals. How is one a prime candidate and the other not? I'm not sure Quan at $6 million (since his 1.5 million dead money is already a sunk cost) is any worse of a value than Jacoby at $4 million (what we'd have to pay him assuming we pick up his $1 million roster bonus). Besides, both players are entering the final year of their deals, so I'm not sure how you can restructure those anyways, unless you somehow did an extension of a year and diverted some of the 2013 salary towards 2014. I think you are just worsening your situation by doing that, though.
    If you cut Q and extend Jones, you lessen his cap hit without worsening the situation.

    I hope they can keep Q, too. I've been a big fan since before he came to Baltimore, and that despite his playing for the Bidwells. I love how he plays the position.

    That's why I was in such shock and dismay with his un-Q-like play recently before the Giants game. I was ecstatic to see the return of the secondary smasher I'd grown to love.

    The big question is, if you're Ozzie, do you see Q on the team and contributing in 2014. Do you see Jones? Of the two, Jones is probably the safer bet. He's younger, and he doesn't play wide-out like an angry fullback. The one you can't see being a big contributor in 2014 (let alone beyond) is the one you might have to make a cap casualty in 2013.




  14. #29
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    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    I wish we had gotten Tandon Doss a heavy role on the offense towards the end here. He's probably the hinge on whether you have to bring back Q or not. If Doss is ready to contribute on an every game basis, you can probably let Q walk. But he hasn't quite shown he's ready yet, so you can't tell.
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    “When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.


    Call me a Special Teams coach again. I dare you! I double dare you, MFer!




  15. #30

    Re: The Ravens can restructure salaries to make room

    Quote Originally Posted by LukeDaniel View Post
    Boldin and Jones both have one year left on their deals. How is one a prime candidate and the other not? I'm not sure Quan at $6 million (since his 1.5 million dead money is already a sunk cost) is any worse of a value than Jacoby at $4 million (what we'd have to pay him assuming we pick up his $1 million roster bonus). Besides, both players are entering the final year of their deals, so I'm not sure how you can restructure those anyways, unless you somehow did an extension of a year and diverted some of the 2013 salary towards 2014. I think you are just worsening your situation by doing that, though.

    Also, I don't believe Pollard was restructured. I believe he was just given an extension. There is a big difference between the two. Pollard's original contract was a 2 year deal, so there would be no way to restructure before the final year of the contract (much like with Jacoby and Quan). When he signed with the Ravens it wasn't reworking the original contract, but rather adding an extension.



    How to handle Boldin seems to be a polarizing topic here. I think the Raven's best option is this (and this is far from my first time saying this). Bring Anquan in and explain to him that your intention is to cut him and, if possible, work out a cheaper extension with him when cut. Offer him $7.6 million over 2 years. Give him a $2 million signing bonus and $2.6 base salary in 2013 and a $3 million base salary in 2014.

    His 2013 Cap figure would be $5.1 million ($2.6 million+ 1 million prorated signing bonus+ 1.5 cap hit from his original signing bonus). Boldin is a valuable, consistent enough player that I think a $5.1 cap allocation makes sense...or at least at lot more than the $7.5 he is scheduled to count against our cap.

    His 2014 Cap Figure would be $4 million ($3 million base salary and $1 million prorated signing bonus). Boldin would be 34 early in the 2014 season, but I don't think this figure makes him too expensive to keep.

    From Boldin's standpoint, it makes sense as well. He gets to stay with a team that knows his talents well. Yes, he won't get his $6 million in salary, but he does get $4.6....$2 million of which he gets to pocket right away by signing his contract. He also has a contract for 2014 at a salary reasonable enough to think he will actually see the money.

    Any thoughts Ravor?

    Who has Ozzie and Biscuits email address....forward this to them! Keep Q!
    I think that the confusion is that people want to extend Jones(which is NOT a simple restructure as you point out) while they don't find it to be a prudent move to give Anquan 3 or 4 more years. Your plan for Q is valid, and I wouldn't put it past the FO to do somethign similar.


    Jones and Leach(te forgotten man in this discussion) BOTH need extensions. Both fit into this team very well and deserve at least 3 or34 more years, which should lower each of their cap numbers. I wouldn't mind simple restructures for Ngata and Suggs, as wel as a paycut for Jameel. Alll of this might make keeping Q around at a lower number feasible.




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