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Thread: Joe 'Manned Up'

  1. #49
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'



    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Is there a point here? Because this makes even less sense.
    So when you play a bad defense, it's just as hard to play a good defense for a QB?

    That must explain why statistically QB's don't do well against the top defenses in the league, and why defensive rankings even exists....




  2. #50
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Justlovemybirds View Post
    Haha I'm pretty certain this is what people are talking about when they say that when it comes to Flacco's success, it's of everyone's doing but his own.


    Points of off turnovers or not, Rice had a game similar to the 49ers one, no where to run.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post


    That's EXACTLY the point Sting and others are trying to make.
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  3. #51
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Different defenses.
    So you admit that Joe is better than Matt Ryan then right? Because its been illustrated on this board that when Joe and Matt have played top five Ds, Joe has SIGNIFICANTLY better stats.

    And Matt Ryan is currently being talked as a top QB.

    And thus Joe is one as well.

    Or does "different defenses" not always count?
    My motto was always to keep swinging. Whether I was in a slump or feeling badly or having trouble off the field, the only thing to do was keep swinging. -Hank Aaron




  4. #52
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by redmike34 View Post
    By what metric?

    When all is said and done, Brady got his offense to score 23 points. Flacco got his offense to score 20. Everything else is ifs, shouldas, wouldas, couldas, etc. They don't keep track of those in official NFL statlines, unless I'm mistaken.

    By the same token (so that you don't think I'm putting the blame for losing the game on Flacco), the defense allowed three points more than the Pats' D did, Harbaugh made more questionable decisions than Belichick, etc. Bottom line is though, despite not having a great game stats-wise, Brady did enough to win. Any argument that Flacco outplayed him is based in statistics which are trumped by the scoreboard.
    By this logic Joe is the second best QB in the NFL right now because he has engineered more wins than all but Tom Brady since 2008. So top five money is right out the window and top 3 money it is!
    My motto was always to keep swinging. Whether I was in a slump or feeling badly or having trouble off the field, the only thing to do was keep swinging. -Hank Aaron




  5. #53
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Ravens had the 3rd ranked defense, Patriots had the 31st ranked defense. Yet people are throwing accusations out to me that I dismiss flacco's ''achievements'' yet everyone forgets about how great this defense has been until this year. Let's just forget about the team when Flacco wins, but blame everyone else when we lose.
    That 31st ranked defense sure showed up to play that day. Vince Wilfork was unstoppable and the rest of their front 7 was on Flacco all night long.

    The Ravens D this year hasn't been very good, but they sure looked like a top ranked D against the Giants last weekend, wouldn't you say? Any given Sunday man.
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  6. #54
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by ActualSpamBot View Post
    So you admit that Joe is better than Matt Ryan then right? Because its been illustrated on this board that when Joe and Matt have played top five Ds, Joe has SIGNIFICANTLY better stats.

    And Matt Ryan is currently being talked as a top QB.

    And thus Joe is one as well.

    Or does "different defenses" not always count?
    I actually think Flacco is slightly better than Matt Ryan. I have them in both the same tier of QB's (second tier).




  7. #55
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    That 31st ranked defense sure showed up to play that day. Vince Wilfork was unstoppable and the rest of their front 7 was on Flacco all night long.

    The Ravens D this year hasn't been very good, but they sure looked like a top ranked D against the Giants last weekend, wouldn't you say? Any given Sunday man.
    Very true, but their pass defense still sucks then as it does now, their front 7 are pretty good.




  8. #56
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    So when you play a bad defense, it's just as hard to play a good defense for a QB?

    That must explain why statistically QB's don't do well against the top defenses in the league, and why defensive rankings even exists....
    How did Eli do against the Ravens defense on Sunday?

    The Ravens D isn't very good this year by several statistical measures.
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  9. #57
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by redmike34 View Post
    By what metric?

    When all is said and done, Brady got his offense to score 23 points. Flacco got his offense to score 20. Everything else is ifs, shouldas, wouldas, couldas, etc. They don't keep track of those in official NFL statlines, unless I'm mistaken.

    By the same token (so that you don't think I'm putting the blame for losing the game on Flacco), the defense allowed three points more than the Pats' D did, Harbaugh made more questionable decisions than Belichick, etc. Bottom line is though, despite not having a great game stats-wise, Brady did enough to win. Any argument that Flacco outplayed him is based in statistics which are trumped by the scoreboard.
    I think I am going to need a slide rule if I am going to keep up the monumental movement of the proverbial goal posts in this thread and this takes the cake ....

    So what you're really saying (but now knowing it) that this is a matter of opinion and perspective. I see that now. But lets not then twist and mince words to fit YOUR opinion in this incredibly twisted narrative.

    Every football person on the planet, who are far more versed in everything football, would look at that game and say Joe out played Brady. And after that game, his praise as such was universal. You do understand it's a generalized term, right?

    It's only the vocal few here, under Herculean efforts, are so desperate to cling to their incredibly narrow narrative that they're resorting to misrepresenting history in a very feeble attempt to make a point.

    .... and it should be noted I think Joe is average at best.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  10. #58
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    How did Eli do against the Ravens defense on Sunday?

    The Ravens D isn't very good this year by several statistical measures.
    They are ranked 13th in total defense believe it or not. http://www.pro-football-reference.co...s/2012/opp.htm




  11. #59

    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by ActualSpamBot View Post
    Utterly ridiculous. Does this idiotic philosophy apply to every player or just QBs? Is Qadry Ishmail a better receiver than Anquan Boldin? Is Kim Herring better than Pollard? What about coordinators? Is Matt Cavanaugh a better coordinator than Josh McDaniels?
    Wow. You're quite the civil debater aren't you?

    Well, since I still don't understand your point I'll merely point out that Marino, though in the position to win the big one once, failed in both circumstances. Dilfer, when he got his shot, made the most of it. I'm not sure why you think any of the other examples you cite matter, though again, as I said, I was confused by your original statement, and am more confused now. Perhaps, if it's possible, you could explain your meaning in actual sentences vice examples without context, and also perhaps without calling me idiotic? Else, I've got better things to do...




  12. #60
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    Re: Joe 'Manned Up'

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Very true, but their pass defense still sucks then as it does now, their front 7 are pretty good.
    So you admit that Joe played pretty damn good even though their D shut down Rice. If their front 7 are pretty good...and stuffed the run all night long (to the tune of something like 2.8 ypc)...and their front 7 was pretty good at getting to Flacco...but Flacco still did really well considering all that...why are you even chiming in on such a ridiculous notion that Flacco struggles when defenses make the Ravens offense 1-dimensional?

    #1 all defenses are schemed to make an opposing offense 1 dimensional.
    #2 all QB's CAN struggle (can being the key word here) when defenses make their offense 1-dimensional.
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