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  1. #37

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost



    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    I remember getting damn near run off this board by some folks for claiming that Birk didn't have the legs anymore.
    Yep, me you and GOTA and I think one or 2 others we're getting fried for saying he was done, and hat was BEFORE Wilfork embarrassed him.




  2. #38

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    The 5M in deadmoney pretty much assures that Ray and McClain will be back, unless Ray retires. Believe Ellerbe is a RFA same with McClellan. But thats a pretty big lock that Kruger is gone and we'll use the draft to replace Ayanbedego and Kruger's spots.

    Theres some much more interesting players that I'd like to see what they cost in dead money. It's obvious that Birk and Wiliams will be gone, Boldin will restructure or be gone. Jones and Leach I'm on the fence, 4M is a nice chunk of savings for a kick returner especially when they've been sending Doss back there alot on punts.

    Leach is a little different. You're saving 3M but that is going to be eaten up a little by whomever you sign. Unless it's a draft pick you're looking at really only saving 1-1.5M giving adding in the deadmoney.




  3. #39
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    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    PFF didn't have him ranked as the second best center in 2011 though, IDK where that came from.
    They didn't have to. It was because of that 2010 rank that there were those who believed that 2011 was an anomaly or maybe an injury. He was ranked so high in 2010 that they didn't see old age catching up with him. Birk's technique has always been good but even in 2010 he had no push as a run blocker despite the website ranking.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  4. #40
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    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Q is gone, unless he takes a pay cut, Ray will probably be asked to take a pay cut, but I don't see him getting cut, especially with the way the DL played, Willis would have had trouble behind our DL. Birk is gone, Williams is gone, I think Jones stays, I think depends on what type of OC they bring in, if they go WC will a 4mil FB be worth it. I would like to see McClain gone, pending his injury, think the cap hit is to high unless they can get Ellerbe at a good price. Reed will Retire he will not put his pride down and he is just to banged up to go somewhere else. Be really surprised if he takes 3mil, can't see them offer him more than that.

    Don't be surprised if some restructuring takes place (Ngata and Suggs) Ngata should take a pay cut based off of his performance the past 1.5 years at his price he should causing more Mendenhall type fumbles and blowing plays up.




  5. #41

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by Sua Sponte View Post
    Q is gone, unless he takes a pay cut, Ray will probably be asked to take a pay cut, but I don't see him getting cut, especially with the way the DL played, Willis would have had trouble behind our DL. Birk is gone, Williams is gone, I think Jones stays, I think depends on what type of OC they bring in, if they go WC will a 4mil FB be worth it. I would like to see McClain gone, pending his injury, think the cap hit is to high unless they can get Ellerbe at a good price. Reed will Retire he will not put his pride down and he is just to banged up to go somewhere else. Be really surprised if he takes 3mil, can't see them offer him more than that.

    Don't be surprised if some restructuring takes place (Ngata and Suggs) Ngata should take a pay cut based off of his performance the past 1.5 years at his price he should causing more Mendenhall type fumbles and blowing plays up.
    Ngata's problems havent been Ngata, but everyone else. The first 4 games each of the past 2 years he's played at a DPOY level, and then he begins to break down. the problem is that he plays far too high a percentage of this teams snaps, commands double teams on every snap and simply wears down faster then we would like. Get him some help, and give him a bit more breather breaks and we will see that DPOY -type player for a longer period of time each year.




  6. #42
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    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    I know the supporting cast sucks, but a guy making 10mil a year finds a few plays ever game, Ngata has not been finding those plays and a few games a non-factor. I'm a huge Ngata fan and know he has been hurt, but he has disappeared as of late.




  7. #43

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by Sua Sponte View Post
    Q is gone, unless he takes a pay cut, Ray will probably be asked to take a pay cut, but I don't see him getting cut, especially with the way the DL played, Willis would have had trouble behind our DL. Birk is gone, Williams is gone, I think Jones stays, I think depends on what type of OC they bring in, if they go WC will a 4mil FB be worth it. I would like to see McClain gone, pending his injury, think the cap hit is to high unless they can get Ellerbe at a good price. Reed will Retire he will not put his pride down and he is just to banged up to go somewhere else. Be really surprised if he takes 3mil, can't see them offer him more than that.

    Don't be surprised if some restructuring takes place (Ngata and Suggs) Ngata should take a pay cut based off of his performance the past 1.5 years at his price he should causing more Mendenhall type fumbles and blowing plays up.
    I seem to remembr Ngatas contract being severly front loaded because we had the space. He has a high cap number this year than the rest of the deal it goes down significantly. I doubt they mess with it. Suggs was also so not sure why he's counting so much towards the cap now.




  8. #44

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    This was 2011. Birk ended the year with a knee injury and wasn't even sure if he was going to retire or not. Next thing you know the Ravens are signing him to a 3 year deal with a big balloon payment starting year 2. That deal forces them to cut him and eat a lot of dead money. The way they structured it they had to know it was going to happen. It never made sense to me.
    It's essentially a one-year, $3M deal. It's structured the way it is because, at the time, they didn't have $3M in Cap space to allocate to him, so he got the veteran minimum for his time of service $925K and a $2.1M bonus. That gave him to lowest possible 2012 Cap number, while still earning $3M.

    So, yes, it's going to create dead money in 2013 - something they most certainly understood - but that was the only way to structure it and fit him in under the Cap in 2012.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  9. #45

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by Sua Sponte View Post
    Don't be surprised if some restructuring takes place (Ngata and Suggs) Ngata should take a pay cut based off of his performance the past 1.5 years at his price he should causing more Mendenhall type fumbles and blowing plays up.
    They may well restructure some deals as a way of creating additional Cap space, but I highly doubt that they ask Ngata for a paycut. Rarely do players take paycuts, even when restructuring, and the team has no leverage to try and force him to do so. Most of the time a request for a paycut comes with an "or else" in the form of the threat of being released. The Ravens can't release him because that would actually cost them more against the Cap than he's going to cost to be on the team.

    Quote Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06 View Post
    I seem to remembr Ngatas contract being severly front loaded because we had the space. He has a high cap number this year than the rest of the deal it goes down significantly. I doubt they mess with it. Suggs was also so not sure why he's counting so much towards the cap now.
    Under his contract, Ngata's Cap numbers have been $7.1M (2011), $10.4M (2012), $11.5M (2013), $16M (2014) and $16M (2015). For cash purposes, the deal was heavily front-loaded in the form of a $25M signing bonus in Sept of 2011 and a $10M option bonus his past March, but for Cap purposes, it was back-loaded - as are most NFL contracts.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  10. #46

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    Looking at this chart I think if Ray Lewis wants to come back he's going to come back. $3 million is just too much dead money. They're not going to push him out the door. He could still end up retiring which means the Ravens are forced to eat it but for that money it's going to be Ray's decision.
    I don't know. At this point, I don't think the team - or any team - is going to be dissuaded by the dead money as long as the savings makes it worthwhile. While Ray is most definitely a unique player, thus making it a unique decision, the savings of $4.35M is substantial. In fact, just as an example, if they were to get Flacco signed to a reasonable long-term deal, that $4.35M would go a long toward covering Flacco's 2013 Cap number.

    Teams would prefer to not carry a lot of dead money, but IMO, it's more about the savings, so that if the savings is substantial enough, they'll be willing to swallow the dead money.

    Quote Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06 View Post
    The 5M in deadmoney pretty much assures that Ray and McClain will be back, unless Ray retires. Believe Ellerbe is a RFA same with McClellan. But thats a pretty big lock that Kruger is gone and we'll use the draft to replace Ayanbedego and Kruger's spots.
    McClain, OTOH, I see a little differently. I don't think the savings versus dead money ratio is as appealing, so I wouldn't expect him to be cut. Especially with the possibility that Ray may not be back and Ellerbe being a UFA (he's a UFA, not an RFA).

    Quote Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06 View Post
    Theres some much more interesting players that I'd like to see what they cost in dead money.
    Name them, and I work up the numbers!
    Last edited by B-more Ravor; 12-19-2012 at 07:45 PM.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  11. #47

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by esmd View Post
    Of all of those guys, the only ones that really should be back are Jones and Leach.
    I was thinking the same.




  12. #48
    iggyman555 Guest

    Re: The impact of franchising Flacco...who could be lost

    Quote Originally Posted by B-more Ravor View Post
    I don't know. At this point, I don't think the team - or any team - is going to be dissuaded by the dead money as long as the savings makes it worthwhile. While Ray is most definitely a unique player, thus making it a unique decision, the savings of $4.35M is substantial. In fact, just as an example, if they were to get Flacco signed to a reasonable long-term deal, that $4.35M would go a long toward covering Flacco's 2013 Cap number.

    Teams would prefer to not carry a lot of dead money, but IMO, it's more about the savings, so that if the savings is substantial enough, they'll be willing to swallow the dead money.



    McClain, OTOH, I see a little differently. I don't think the savings versus dead money ratio is as appealing, so I wouldn't expect him to be cut. Especially with the possibility that Ray may not be back and Ellerbe being a UFA (he's a UFA, not an RFA).



    Name them, and I work up the numbers!

    you're awesome, you sure you dont work for the ravens FO? lol




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