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  1. #211
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    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future



    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    They have Levi Brown and Lyle Sendlein on IR... Sendlein is a pretty good center, Levi Brown is not good at all at LT but he could move inside to guard or RT. I know they drafted a couple of young tackles, Bobby Massie and Nate Potter, I liked both of those guys in the last draft.

    They are drafting 11th and could also easily grab one of the top tackles. Getting their injured guys back and possibly grabbing a new LT should dramatically improve their OL next year. They have one of the top 3 WRs in the game, a highly drafted and very physical young WR in Michael Floyd, and a good backfield duo.

    Bottom line is that Joe Flacco would probably make Arizona into a wild card contender at a minimum in 2013.
    Agreed, the Cards also have a really good underrated defense. Joe would be a good fit for them, I'm not sure if he'll ever be able to deliver them a SB though.




  2. #212

    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    They have Levi Brown and Lyle Sendlein on IR... Sendlein is a pretty good center, Levi Brown is not good at all at LT but he could move inside to guard or RT. I know they drafted a couple of young tackles, Bobby Massie and Nate Potter, I liked both of those guys in the last draft.

    They are drafting 11th and could also easily grab one of the top tackles. Getting their injured guys back and possibly grabbing a new LT should dramatically improve their OL next year. They have one of the top 3 WRs in the game, a highly drafted and very physical young WR in Michael Floyd, and a good backfield duo.

    Bottom line is that Joe Flacco would probably make Arizona into a wild card contender at a minimum in 2013.
    In the same division with what looks like a pair of very solid teams (both now and in the short-term future) in Seattle and SF? Maybe, but I'd put money on Arizona being the third best team in that division, at best... particularly since they will also be getting a new coach/system and have growing pains associated with that. I'd not bet against Fisher getting the Rams into pretty good position by next year too.

    NFC West has the best division record this year, and it doesn't look like they're going to slow down anytime soon. Pretty drastic turnaround for a division that was won by a 7-9 team a couple of years ago.




  3. #213
    iggyman555 Guest

    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    Quote Originally Posted by Bawlamer View Post
    And what do you think the next HC of New York will be asking Mike Tannenbaum?
    tannenbaum will be gone before rexy




  4. #214
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    We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    I'm just asking. Someone posted this on another board. I'm not a cap expert but would like to hear from some of our guys that are, especially RAVOR.

    Is Joe asking for $17M and if he is, exactly who do we lose if not these guys or is there a way to know now?
    __________________________________

    I did the research and it is ugly. If we got rid of Birk, Reed, Ray, and Q and a couple of others, we would have about $17 million of cap room.

    Sign Flacco for $17 M a year and we're done! Of course, that means Ellerbe, Cary Williams, and Kruger walk. So, we need 2 ILB, a CB, a S, and a DE just to get back to even. Plus we need a LT/LG, C, a blocking TE, and someone to rush the passer opposite Suggs. I think J. Smith, Asa Jackson, and Graham can replace Cary. So, we may just need the other positions in the draft. Sign Flacco for $13 M and we can probably keep Ellerbe, or let McClain go and sign Flacco for $15 M.




  5. #215
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    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    This is what Matt Schaub signed for this past September, and this is basically the contract I would offer Flacco if I were Ozzie and Bisciotti:

    9/9/2012: Signed a five-year, $66.15 million contract. The deal contains $29.15 million guaranteed -- a $17.5 million signing bonus and Schaub's base salaries in years one and two. 2012: $4.4 million, 2013: $7.25 million, 2014: $10 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2015: $12.5 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2016: $14.5 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2017: Free Agent

    If Flacco turned this offer down, then I would use the franchise tag on him and work out a trade. The Ravens are going to be in a rebuilding mode next year anyway.




  6. #216
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    And this needed to be a NEW thread?




  7. #217
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    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    I love that 7.5 cap hit in 2013, we could certainly improve this team with only 7.5 odd million to commit to Joe next year. If Joe turns that down that, then he's not thinking of the bigger picture.




  8. #218
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    I posted the thread which was pretty much making the same point, but we're certainly on the same page. We WONT be able to compete next year with that much committed money, we could be the next Oakland Raiders.




  9. #219
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    Thanks. I knew we'd lose some guys and management has been hinting strongly at this but all those guys. We'd be like OAK? Damn.

    Sorry if it's a duplicate thread.




  10. #220
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    Quote Originally Posted by AirFlacco View Post
    Thanks. I knew we'd lose some guys and management has been hinting strongly at this but all those guys. We'd be like OAK? Damn.

    Sorry if it's a duplicate thread.
    I say the Oakland Raiders, because they had a ridiculous amount of stupid contracts that caught up on them cap wise, this year they had to release a ton of talent, and it wasn't like they were any good before anyway going 8-8 twice in a row. Joe Flacco is just not worth 17 million dollars no matter how anyone debates Joe, he isn't worth that much, simple as that, end of story.




  11. #221
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    This team has way too many holes to be paying Flacco 17 mil. I just hope they get a reasonable deal done.




  12. #222
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    Re: We lose all these guys if Joe signs for $17M???

    DITTO on that guys. Nobody is worth it but that's the CATCH 22
    of it. So let Joe walk and we're still the OAK Raiders with someone
    like Henne off the scrap pile Lord forbid.

    BTW, these are the first names I've seen in print including Ray's.

    Makes me sick.




  13. #223

    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    Quote Originally Posted by redmike34 View Post
    In the same division with what looks like a pair of very solid teams (both now and in the short-term future) in Seattle and SF? Maybe, but I'd put money on Arizona being the third best team in that division, at best... particularly since they will also be getting a new coach/system and have growing pains associated with that. I'd not bet against Fisher getting the Rams into pretty good position by next year too.

    NFC West has the best division record this year, and it doesn't look like they're going to slow down anytime soon. Pretty drastic turnaround for a division that was won by a 7-9 team a couple of years ago.
    They might be the 3rd best team in the division, but frankly that doesn't keep them out of contention for a wild card spot. SF and Seattle are definitely better, but is Arizona with competent QB play really worse than Chicago, Dallas, Washington, or New Orleans? Those are the teams they'd be competing with for a wild card. Arizona already has a top 5, top 10 defense and a lot of great pieces on offense. Next year there could easily be 3 playoff teams from the NFC West.

    The ONLY thing holding them back is offensive line and QB play. We know their OL will be better next year just because of guys coming back from injury and young guys getting more experience. They need at least average play from the QB spot, which they were getting when Kolb was healthy and the team was 4-1, problem with Kolb is that he's proven at this point that he can't start more than 8 or so games a year due to health. As soon as he got hurt the team went down the crapper because they went from average QB situation to worst QB situation in the league.




  14. #224

    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    They might be the 3rd best team in the division, but frankly that doesn't keep them out of contention for a wild card spot. SF and Seattle are definitely better, but is Arizona with competent QB play really worse than Chicago, Dallas, Washington, or New Orleans? Those are the teams they'd be competing with for a wild card. Arizona already has a top 5, top 10 defense and a lot of great pieces on offense. Next year there could easily be 3 playoff teams from the NFC West.

    The ONLY thing holding them back is offensive line and QB play. We know their OL will be better next year just because of guys coming back from injury and young guys getting more experience. They need at least average play from the QB spot, which they were getting when Kolb was healthy and the team was 4-1, problem with Kolb is that he's proven at this point that he can't start more than 8 or so games a year due to health. As soon as he got hurt the team went down the crapper because they went from average QB situation to worst QB situation in the league.
    Yeah, I absolutely agree about the Cards' defense--I think they're still leading the league in defensive passer rating, despite the fact that they're losing most games.

    To me, the pertinent question there is if Whisenhunt stays. If he does, I think a Whisenhunt/Flacco combo could possibly do some damage. If not, and there's a new coach coming in... I don't see a new coach, installing a new system, being immediately competitive in that division, irrespective of who his QB is. And if they make a not-great HC selection, they might be perennial bottom-dwellers for a while, once again irrespective of who the QB is.

    Arizona this year is quite the cautionary tale...




  15. #225

    Re: Flacco's perfromance, contract and future

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirt1 View Post
    This is what Matt Schaub signed for this past September, and this is basically the contract I would offer Flacco if I were Ozzie and Bisciotti:

    9/9/2012: Signed a five-year, $66.15 million contract. The deal contains $29.15 million guaranteed -- a $17.5 million signing bonus and Schaub's base salaries in years one and two. 2012: $4.4 million, 2013: $7.25 million, 2014: $10 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2015: $12.5 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2016: $14.5 million (+ $1 million in per-game roster bonuses), 2017: Free Agent

    If Flacco turned this offer down, then I would use the franchise tag on him and work out a trade. The Ravens are going to be in a rebuilding mode next year anyway.
    I hear ya, but Flacco is 27 and Schaub is 31. That makes a big difference when you're talking about money in a long term deal. Schaub will be 35 at the end of that deal. If Flacco got the same deal, he'd only be 31 at the end of the deal - the same age Schaub is now.

    More importantly, though, if Flacco won't accept whatever deal the Ravens are offering, then how are they going to be able to trade him? He's first going to have to agree to terms with the new team and sign his franchise tender in order to be traded. If he's asking the Ravens for too much, then I don't think anyone else is going to be willing to pay that either. Plus there's the issue of trade compensation. If a team has a need, they usually don't mind making a trade or signing a FA to fill that spot, but teams rarely are interested in making a trade AND paying top dollar for a contract.

    A "tag and trade" always sounds good, but in reality, it's really hard to pull off.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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