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  1. #73
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    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?



    Quote Originally Posted by trailhiker85 View Post
    I have to think that these past few weeks have improved the odds of Pat Shurmur keeping his HC job in Cleveland. The Brownies have already won more games than they did in 2011. They'll still end up in the AFCN cellar but they actually seem to be showing improvement.

    Not sure how I feel about the prospect of Norv Turner becoming OC here. I know he's got the resume, and would be an upgrade over Cam, but I can't say I'd be jumping with joy over the prospect. I certainly agree with you where Moeller is concerned, though.
    Also a valid point and I agree about Norv Turner. He doesn't excite me.
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  2. #74

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by RavingMad View Post
    Bisciotti and Ozzie aren't totally sold on Flacco.

    I'm not so sure on that RM. Bisciotti said last Spring/Summer that Flacco was going nowhere and that they had made an offer to Flacco that was more than what many people would expect.

    Now, perhaps that was just window-dressing - or that their thinking has changed - but he seemed pretty sold on Flacco (at least, at that point).
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  3. #75
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    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by B-more Ravor View Post
    I'm not so sure on that RM. Bisciotti said last Spring/Summer that Flacco was going nowhere and that they had made an offer to Flacco that was more than what many people would expect.

    Now, perhaps that was just window-dressing - or that their thinking has changed - but he seemed pretty sold on Flacco (at least, at that point).
    Is it just possible that Ozzie and Bisciotti are sold on Flacco, but only at a certain price? I would love to get a 5-series BMW, and am sold on it at a price of $50,000, but not so much at $80,000.




  4. #76

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirt1 View Post
    Is it just possible that Ozzie and Bisciotti are sold on Flacco, but only at a certain price? I would love to get a 5-series BMW, and am sold on it at a price of $50,000, but not so much at $80,000.
    Absolutely, but based on Bisciotti's comment, it sounds like it's still a pretty high number (although, obviously under what Flacco is/was seeking).

    But, again, that may just have been playing to the PR game.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  5. #77

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    We can all be mad at Harbaugh, but the guy has won a lot of football games and turned us into a dynasty of sorts. He is safe.

    Same for Joe, really. Yeah, he is maddening but above-average QBs with huge arms don't grow on trees. Dumping Flacco and trying to draft someone from our usual draft position would be crazy.




  6. #78
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    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    We can all be mad at Harbaugh, but the guy has won a lot of football games and turned us into a dynasty of sorts. He is safe.

    Same for Joe, really. Yeah, he is maddening but above-average QBs with huge arms don't grow on trees. Dumping Flacco and trying to draft someone from our usual draft position would be crazy.
    But what if a team gave the Ravens a Top 10 pick in the first round for Flacco? Then the Ravens wouldn't be drafting in the 20s. Yes, I am looking at you AZ, KC, JAX, or OAK.




  7. #79

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirt1 View Post
    But what if a team gave the Ravens a Top 10 pick in the first round for Flacco? Then the Ravens wouldn't be drafting in the 20s. Yes, I am looking at you AZ, KC, JAX, or OAK.
    Flacco is a quarterback who has the upside to go on the road and drive 92 yards against the best defense in the league for a last-second win. He has the upside to throw his way to a Super Bowl when his star running back is averaging 3 yards a carry. He has the upside to win any game in the NFL at any time anywhere.

    I understand full well that his primary drawback is his ability to combine that kind of upside with maddening inconsistency, but I'm sorry, you don't throw that away for a top 10 draft pick, 50% of which end up being full blown BUSTS (as in not on the team or not even in football anymore) by years 4 or 5.

    There are NO prospects in the draft who are such can't-miss locks as to make you give up on a guy like Flacco. Look at the Colts last year--they took Andrew Luck over Peyton Manning, and that was an incredibly difficult decision. But Manning was 37 years old with a neck hanging on by a thread at 20 million a year, while Andrew Luck was the best quarterback prospect since John Elway. You're not even talking about a decision like that! You're talking about dump Flacco, spin the wheel, and see how things fall! That is idiotic.




  8. #80

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    I hope the fanbase doesnt expect immediate miracles with Joe. He is gonna have to go through a cleansing process. Whether he doesnt want to admit it or not, Cam has had a big influence on Joe. I assume Jim's offense will have more shorter route options during a 3rd and 2, but Joe will probably see 1 on 1 coverage on the outside and instinctly want to throw that 9 route. As Yoda said.... He must unlean what he has learned. Take's time.




  9. #81
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    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by ravensnhokies View Post
    I hope the fanbase doesnt expect immediate miracles with Joe. He is gonna have to go through a cleansing process. Whether he doesnt want to admit it or not, Cam has had a big influence on Joe. I assume Jim's offense will have more shorter route options during a 3rd and 2, but Joe will probably see 1 on 1 coverage on the outside and instinctly want to throw that 9 route. As Yoda said.... He must unlean what he has learned. Take's time.
    I would agree somewhat. But some of the bigger plays this year he has hit players in a seam or coming in or out of the middle. Look at the locations of the TD throws last week. What was the routes.




  10. #82
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    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Flacco is a quarterback who has the upside to go on the road and drive 92 yards against the best defense in the league for a last-second win. He has the upside to throw his way to a Super Bowl when his star running back is averaging 3 yards a carry. He has the upside to win any game in the NFL at any time anywhere.

    I understand full well that his primary drawback is his ability to combine that kind of upside with maddening inconsistency, but I'm sorry, you don't throw that away for a top 10 draft pick, 50% of which end up being full blown BUSTS (as in not on the team or not even in football anymore) by years 4 or 5.

    There are NO prospects in the draft who are such can't-miss locks as to make you give up on a guy like Flacco. Look at the Colts last year--they took Andrew Luck over Peyton Manning, and that was an incredibly difficult decision. But Manning was 37 years old with a neck hanging on by a thread at 20 million a year, while Andrew Luck was the best quarterback prospect since John Elway. You're not even talking about a decision like that! You're talking about dump Flacco, spin the wheel, and see how things fall! That is idiotic.
    So, is there any limit to what you would pay Flacco? What is idiotic is to hand Flacco a blank check, because you have no confidence in your FO to draft another QB. Russell Wilson was what a third round pick, and could be rookie of the year. I think Ozzie is a great GM, but in the entire time the Ravens have been in Baltimore, he has hit on one QB and one WR. (Flacco and Torrey Smith). What would be so shocking if Bisciotti turned to Ozzie and said, "Find me another good young QB in the draft"?




  11. #83

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirt1 View Post
    So, is there any limit to what you would pay Flacco? What is idiotic is to hand Flacco a blank check, because you have no confidence in your FO to draft another QB. Russell Wilson was what a third round pick, and could be rookie of the year. I think Ozzie is a great GM, but in the entire time the Ravens have been in Baltimore, he has hit on one QB and one WR. (Flacco and Torrey Smith). What would be so shocking if Bisciotti turned to Ozzie and said, "Find me another good young QB in the draft"?
    You are making this into a false dilemma, I.E., your argument is that there are only two options:

    1) Pay Flacco a back-breaking salary that renders this team unable to compete ever again, or
    2) Dump Flacco.

    The reality is that both of those two things are unlikely. In your world, no team would ever be able to re-sign their quarterback.

    The most likely scenario is that the Ravens re-sign Flacco to a deal both sides are comfortable with, and I believe that can happen. Another problem with your argument is that we have no idea what the present state of the negotiations are or who is asking for what. We will NEVER know those things, and don't assume the "leaked information" you get from the press is anything other than what it is--noise, fog, and misdirection.




  12. #84

    Re: So is Flacco on tht seat now, or is it Harbaugh?

    I think the first stumbling block (and major one) was exorcising Cam. Now its just numbers.

    I'd say 7yrs - 100-105M with $30-35M guaranteed with major incentives added on.

    Joe's a $14M+/yr type QB with his skillset and potential. All the teams that dont have franchise QBs would easily pay that much for Joe on his POTENTIAL. The Ravens would probably be given a slight discount b/c they are winners, he is comfortable here... even more w/o Cam... yada yada. But he isn't gonna take a huge hometeam discount under his market value. Like or not it, Ravens have gotta come to grips with the fact that their aging Superstars just arent worth big chunks of the salary cap. Lewis and Reed are icons here and we would all love to see them get another SB ring here (1st one for Ed), but if it means jettisoning them to get someone younger, cheaper, more reliable healthwise and probably as good on the field in their place....count me in. At the end of the day, its a business, and the Ravens' job is to win.
    Last edited by ravensnhokies; 12-11-2012 at 04:26 PM.




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