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  1. #25

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?



    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    It's hard to say what amount of time would be "enough." I would argue that the Flacco situation is the single most important contract negotiation in Ravens history. ANY additional information helps the decision-making process.

    There's so many unknown variables that make it impossible to speculate as fans... as you said, we have no idea what Flacco is demanding outside of what has been leaked to the press, and information leaked to the press is totally unreliable. People involved in the negotiations don't leak info to inform anybody, but rather to manipulate the situation to their advantage. I believe absolutely nothing I've heard thus far.
    I completely agree with everything here, especially this:

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    I would argue that the Flacco situation is the single most important contract negotiation in Ravens history.




  2. #26
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    I've been reading a lot of comments about Joe holding onto the ball too long. And he's consistently been among the top fumblers in the league for five seasons, getting worse each year, among the likes of Sanchez, Newton, Vick, Cassel, Rivers, and Tebow. Not good, particularly for a guy who doesn't run much.

    But I've often wondered how much of this is attributable to playing in Cameron's system. Recall that the "Air Coryell" scheme is a very vertical attack, and each year Cameron had seemed to rely on the scheme more and more. With speed of Torrey and Jacoby, the thought was that this season, more than any other, would be one in which the Ravens could attack downfield and take advantage of Flacco's big arm.

    And it worked. Coming into yesterday's game, Flacco was fourth in the league in 20+ yard completions with 51 (Luck 56, Peyton 53, Brees 52). Yesterday he had three completions over 20 yards and another 19 yard TD to Boldin.

    My contention is this. Cam wanted Flacco to throw the long ball, and it requires that your QB stand in the pocket for a long time as the play develops. The first TD to Boldin was a double move that required Flacco to pump and then wait, wait, wait, for quite a bit before letting the ball go. With protection, it paid off. When the protection isn't as good, as we saw later with Oher, standing around like that causes the fumbles we've seen. Remember, we're talking about the proverbial blind side. I know what people are saying when they want Flacco to hear footsteps, but I suspect pressure from the blindside is what you get when you ask the QB to stand there and wait for the deep man to get open.

    So... what I expect is that with Cam gone, we'll see fewer deep balls and "explosive" plays, but on the plus side, more complex, shorter routes, quicker reads and fewer sacks and fumbles. I hope to see less pressure on Oher. I've noticed that Flacco has not done a good job this season throwing the ball prior to receivers coming out of breaks. I hope that, too, is improved with less focus on throwing deep and letting receivers run underneath.




  3. #27
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    It's hard to say what amount of time would be "enough." I would argue that the Flacco situation is the single most important contract negotiation in Ravens history. ANY additional information helps the decision-making process.
    I suspect they are willing to franchise Flacco and give him most of next year to show where he belongs in the NFL QB hierarchy. The remaining games this see will be more about seeing if handing him completely over to Caldwell can catch lightening in a bottle and warrant continuing with that approach next year or whether Caldwell is better as a position coach and they'll need to fetch someone like Norv Turner to gameplan for Joe in 2013.




  4. #28
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    I have no problem being critical of Flacco but he needs help. They have to run the ball to get play action working. If they can't block the pass rush they need to move the pocket, call quick screens and delayed draws.

    When he has protection he can make every throw IMO. Those two turnovers yesterday were really not his fault, again IMO
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  5. #29

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post
    I've been reading a lot of comments about Joe holding onto the ball too long. And he's consistently been among the top fumblers in the league for five seasons, getting worse each year, among the likes of Sanchez, Newton, Vick, Cassel, Rivers, and Tebow. Not good, particularly for a guy who doesn't run much.

    But I've often wondered how much of this is attributable to playing in Cameron's system. Recall that the "Air Coryell" scheme is a very vertical attack, and each year Cameron had seemed to rely on the scheme more and more. With speed of Torrey and Jacoby, the thought was that this season, more than any other, would be one in which the Ravens could attack downfield and take advantage of Flacco's big arm.

    And it worked. Coming into yesterday's game, Flacco was fourth in the league in 20+ yard completions with 51 (Luck 56, Peyton 53, Brees 52). Yesterday he had three completions over 20 yards and another 19 yard TD to Boldin.

    My contention is this. Cam wanted Flacco to throw the long ball, and it requires that your QB stand in the pocket for a long time as the play develops. The first TD to Boldin was a double move that required Flacco to pump and then wait, wait, wait, for quite a bit before letting the ball go. With protection, it paid off. When the protection isn't as good, as we saw later with Oher, standing around like that causes the fumbles we've seen. Remember, we're talking about the proverbial blind side. I know what people are saying when they want Flacco to hear footsteps, but I suspect pressure from the blindside is what you get when you ask the QB to stand there and wait for the deep man to get open.

    So... what I expect is that with Cam gone, we'll see fewer deep balls and "explosive" plays, but on the plus side, more complex, shorter routes, quicker reads and fewer sacks and fumbles. I hope to see less pressure on Oher. I've noticed that Flacco has not done a good job this season throwing the ball prior to receivers coming out of breaks. I hope that, too, is improved with less focus on throwing deep and letting receivers run underneath.
    The difference between joe and the other guys on the deep ball list is the distance the ball is traveling in the air. Under the Ravens offense the deep balls are just about all throwing the ball deep over top the defense. The other QBs hit receivers on slants and other quick hitters and give them a chance stretch the play out.

    The sack strips increasing this year are a result of a couple of things. One as you mentioned the deep routes. The oline is really bad on the edges this year as Osmele and Oher are worse than McKinnie and Oher from last year. The regression of the middle of the Oline. He rarely has a clean pocket to step up in. He has also held the ball longer than he should waiting for receivers to get open. With the defense playing poorly I think he is putting more pressure on himself to make something happen. He also needs to step up and get rid of it quicker. The fumble yesterday he should have stepped up in the pocket. Oher got beat pretty badly but if Joe had stepped up he may have been able to get rid of the ball. It was a straightline to him once the End got around Oher rather than having to curl back in to get him.




  6. #30

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    There's so many unknown variables that make it impossible to speculate as fans... as you said, we have no idea what Flacco is demanding outside of what has been leaked to the press, and information leaked to the press is totally unreliable. People involved in the negotiations don't leak info to inform anybody, but rather to manipulate the situation to their advantage. I believe absolutely nothing I've heard thus far.
    Well, I agree that without official information, it is all speculation. But I do know that, historically, the Ravens have always done right by their home-grown players. Occassionally a drafted player has left (Grubbs, Adalius Thomas, etc.), but usually that was because another team made a market-setting deal, not because the Ravens were low-balling the player.

    I got back to B-More's analysis on Flacco's worth...the Ravens don't know, so they probably offerred him a conservative deal + incentives (Ozzie loves incentives). It therefore stands to reason, due to lack of a deal, that Flacco's camp wants more guaranteed money.

    In other words, the Ravens see an above-average QB with the potential to be very good if not great, and Flacco's camp sees a very good QB that has already proven his worth.




  7. #31

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by webbrick2007 View Post
    The blitz that caused him to throw the interception in the red-zone was from his front side. He never saw it because he was staring down his primary receiver (pre and post snap).
    Wow, what game were you watching? He slid to his left, he saw it fine what he did wrong was not decide to either throw it away immediately or take the sack.

    Its amazing how some people see what they want to prove something.




  8. #32
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by akili View Post
    I need help here, friends.
    Will Joe Statue ever be able to move around in a pocket or is this a football trait that he is simply unable to master? It's no secret that he has a terrific arm, although inconsistency constantly plagues him. But why can he not ever seem to buy himself more time in the pocket like all other QBs? Obviously, he's a good athlete and smart in other respects. What prevents him from moving around back there and, god forbid, maybe even run the ball once in a while when the pocket breaks down?
    It's getting very hard to watch this act repeat itself week in and week out.
    Joe has a very strong arm and possesses many phyisical talents. He does not seem to be much of a leader as I often see him sitting or standing alone on the sidelines. Manning and Brady are always meeting with the O-line and others on the sidelines reviewing photos and discussing strategy which I rarely seee from Joe. Also, I do not get the impression that Joe is a quick thinker and can adjust to changes in the defense. Just my humble opinion.




  9. #33
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Prior to the Ravens loss yesterday, the last time a team lost when their quarterback threw 3+ TDs, no more than 1 INT, 75% or better completion percentage, and 8+ yards per attempt was September 23, 2007. Philip Rivers w/ the Chargers @ Green Bay.

    That was 74 games in a row where the quarterback had that kind of performance and the team won the game.

    So out of the last 75 occurrences (64 of which have been since Flacco entered the NFL), the ONLY TIME the team lost the game was Yesterday.

    So how about we don't blame Flacco for yesterday's loss, mmkay?




  10. #34
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    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bawlamer View Post
    If it takes Joe longer then make the play selection quicker. Have your OL put their helmets in the bellies of th DL so they can't block the pass and gttr done. However, Joe must learn to after 2.5 seconds to through the ball in the dirt while at the same time being mindful of intentional grounding. A no huddle, short passing game with an occasional long one, will suit Joe. Just like Peyton he's more a pocket passer than a scrambler. And let's not forget about Rice and Pierce.
    The way Cam draws up the plays, if Flacco was supposed to throw the ball in the dirt if nobody was open after 2.5 seconds, then he would never complete a pass. That's why he doesn't do that. You all say he needs to have an internal clock, but Cam's "everybody go long" passing attack pretty much necessitated that Flacco keep waiting forever, which is why he doesn't do what you're all asking him to do.

    Once again, it all comes back to Cam. He was the problem. Now that he's gone, hopefully we can stop with the "everybody go long" shenanigans and get in some plays that actually help our receivers get open quickly enough to let Flacco throw the ball while the line can still hold back the pass rush. It's like that entire concept never connected with Cam that it might be something important to consider. Good riddance.




  11. #35

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by callahan09 View Post
    Prior to the Ravens loss yesterday, the last time a team lost when their quarterback threw 3+ TDs, no more than 1 INT, 75% or better completion percentage, and 8+ yards per attempt was September 23, 2007. Philip Rivers w/ the Chargers @ Green Bay.

    That was 74 games in a row where the quarterback had that kind of performance and the team won the game.

    So out of the last 75 occurrences (64 of which have been since Flacco entered the NFL), the ONLY TIME the team lost the game was Yesterday.

    So how about we don't blame Flacco for yesterday's loss, mmkay?
    Why is 75% completion percentage that important? I am curious. It seems a bit arbitrary.

    How often does the rest of it occur? Also curious.




  12. #36

    Re: Does Joe Flacco, a/k/a Joe Statue, have a Low Football IQ?

    Quote Originally Posted by callahan09 View Post
    So how about we don't blame Flacco for yesterday's loss, mmkay?
    It was a team loss to be sure, but I don't know anyone can look at the second half and see only 1 TD, 55 yards of passing offense against one of the worst pass defenses in the league, and a red-zone INT and not say that Flacco (and the rest of the offense...and the former OC) had a lot to do with the Ravens not winning that game.




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