Page 55 of 266 FirstFirst ... 54551525354555657585965105 ... LastLast
Results 811 to 825 of 3987
  1. #811

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread



    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    I don't think the team is going to draft another guy with the assumption that they will be starting over Gino unless it's Barrett Jones. Benevides is a solid guy, but I think Gino has done nothing but give the team more confidence in him that he can do the job throughout the season.

    I think another guy may be taken for depth late in the draft, but I don't think C is going to be an issue for this team next year.

    I was kind of going at it in another thread, but I also think any thought that we are going to be paying a lot of money or trading way up (probably no higher than 5 spots ahead of where we are going to pick) to pick a LT is wishful thinking on the fans part. The team is content with Oher...I don't think people really realize how bad some other teams LT's are considering the constant bashing Oher gets...and considering anybody would think a guy like Jermon Bushrod would be an upgrade (or that any team at all would allow a franchise type LT hit the open market...Personally I don't even think Albert is all that great either) is REALLY out of it.

    As for the DL...one guy who I think we should look at to help out at NT is Casey Hampton. I know he is old and you really don't want him in there playing a ton of snaps, but when he is fresh, he can still play at a pretty high level. He would be cheap and it would only have to be for 2 years max or so...and maybe he can help groom and give Cody tips.

    As for the game last night, I watched a lot of Elam and Bostic...and neither really did anything to stand out. I don't want to say they were disappointing as I didn't really see them struggling, but I expected more. Is Bostic a senior?
    Bostic is a senior and solid, but not great, IMO. The biggest weakness in his game is pass coverage, which is obviously a problem, but he's pretty good against the run. He's not a target for the Ravens unless he were to fall into the later rounds IMO. Elam didn't have a very impressive game but Bridgewater didn't throw a lot into his coverage. He played well in his run fits which is standard for him.

    I've agreed with you regarding a lot of your views on the OL in other threads, but I have to point out that the reason Oher is constantly bashed is that he is constantly making mistakes and playing poorly. The criticism he receives is pretty much totally warranted--other teams might have left tackles who get beat a lot, but Oher's problems run deeper than just getting beat by good pass rushers, which happens to all LTs.

    The book is out on Oher at this point and it says that he's beatable physically but moreso mentally. You can beat him with a speed rush, then once he starts overcompensating for that you can beat him with the inside move. You can also beat him anytime you please with a twist, stunt, or zone blitz, and if you overload the left side you can bet bottom dollar he'll pick up the wrong blitzer or just plain not block anybody at all.

    Guys like Jeff Backus, Sam Baker, Max Starks, etc. are the guys in Oher's league--the bottom 3rd of LTs in the league. Those guys are mostly in that tier because they're among the more athletically limited tackles in the league whether by age or talent. But you rarely see them standing around not knowing who to block and then giving up on the play like Oher does. The tendency to not give 100% effort and then give up on the play is something we didn't see out of Oher before this year really and it's really troubling--possibly indicative that he's totally lost confidence.

    Oher's struggles aren't all on him but until he gets smarter and more confident with his game he will play under his physical potential, and that puts him firmly in the "mediocre to poor" category. I don't think we can upgrade on him outside of the draft but I think you'd be hard pressed to say he's in the top 20 LTs in the NFL.




  2. #812

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Bostic is a senior and solid, but not great, IMO. The biggest weakness in his game is pass coverage, which is obviously a problem, but he's pretty good against the run. He's not a target for the Ravens unless he were to fall into the later rounds IMO. Elam didn't have a very impressive game but Bridgewater didn't throw a lot into his coverage. He played well in his run fits which is standard for him.

    I've agreed with you regarding a lot of your views on the OL in other threads, but I have to point out that the reason Oher is constantly bashed is that he is constantly making mistakes and playing poorly. The criticism he receives is pretty much totally warranted--other teams might have left tackles who get beat a lot, but Oher's problems run deeper than just getting beat by good pass rushers, which happens to all LTs.

    The book is out on Oher at this point and it says that he's beatable physically but moreso mentally. You can beat him with a speed rush, then once he starts overcompensating for that you can beat him with the inside move. You can also beat him anytime you please with a twist, stunt, or zone blitz, and if you overload the left side you can bet bottom dollar he'll pick up the wrong blitzer or just plain not block anybody at all.

    Guys like Jeff Backus, Sam Baker, Max Starks, etc. are the guys in Oher's league--the bottom 3rd of LTs in the league. Those guys are mostly in that tier because they're among the more athletically limited tackles in the league whether by age or talent. But you rarely see them standing around not knowing who to block and then giving up on the play like Oher does. The tendency to not give 100% effort and then give up on the play is something we didn't see out of Oher before this year really and it's really troubling--possibly indicative that he's totally lost confidence.

    Oher's struggles aren't all on him but until he gets smarter and more confident with his game he will play under his physical potential, and that puts him firmly in the "mediocre to poor" category. I don't think we can upgrade on him outside of the draft but I think you'd be hard pressed to say he's in the top 20 LTs in the NFL.
    Oh, I definitely think he is in the top 20.

    Can you honestly...honestly name 15 better LT's int his league?

    And frankly, the elite guys haven't won anything...Joe Thomas, Jake Long, D'Brickashaw Ferguson, Jason Peters...none have won anything.

    Look at the LT's on the last couple championship teams...Matt Light, Will Beatty last year. Jonathan Scott and an ancient Chad Clifton before. Charlie Johnson and Jermon Bushrod before that. I could go on and on.

    I think he is right about average...hell there were people that were swearing up and down that Harbaugh was an idiot for leaving the "clearly better" Mckinnie on the bench and not starting him over Oher. I think we clearly saw why he isn't any better this past Sunday.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  3. #813

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Oh, I definitely think he is in the top 20.

    Can you honestly...honestly name 15 better LT's int his league?

    And frankly, the elite guys haven't won anything...Joe Thomas, Jake Long, D'Brickashaw Ferguson, Jason Peters...none have won anything.

    Look at the LT's on the last couple championship teams...Matt Light, Will Beatty last year. Jonathan Scott and an ancient Chad Clifton before. Charlie Johnson and Jermon Bushrod before that. I could go on and on.

    I think he is right about average...hell there were people that were swearing up and down that Harbaugh was an idiot for leaving the "clearly better" Mckinnie on the bench and not starting him over Oher. I think we clearly saw why he isn't any better this past Sunday.
    Whether they have "won anything" or not is irrelevant to the question of how good they are protecting the passer and blocking in the run game.

    Getting into arguments about rankings is usually pointless, but again, Oher is more TALENTED than a lot of tackles, but that doesn't mean he's better, because talent is only half of the equation. Technique (both mentally and physically) is the other and that's where Oher is lacking.

    If I were a GM I would take the following guys over Oher, each group in no particular order: FIRST TIER - 1) Joe Thomas 2) Trent Williams 3) Russell Okung 4) Duane Brown 5) Joe Staley 6) Ryan Clady 7) Andrew Whitworth 8) Michael Roos SECOND TIER - 9) Tyron Smith 10) Jordan Gross 11) Branden Albert 12) Jared Veldheer 13) D'Brickashaw Ferguson 14) Matt Kalil 15) Donald Penn 16) Eugene Monroe

    There's an easy 16 off the top of my head. Add Jason Peters to the first tier if he comes back healthy next year, Jared Gaither if he'll ever be healthy again (big if), and Jake Long if this year was some sort of fluke/injury issue. Nate Solder and Anthony Castonzo are a little too unproven to get there at this point but they're in the conversation for the second tier.

    Oher's category includes these guys, again in no order: 1) Oher 2) Will Beatty (who was actually fairly good this year but is injury prone) 3) Jeff Backus 4) Sam Baker 5) Jermon Bushrod 6) Max Starks 7) Chris Hairston, and then there's the REALLY bad guys like 8) Levi Brown, 9) Rodger Saffold, 10) Marshall Newhouse, and 11) J'Marcus Webb. That's all 32 starting LTs in the league.

    The first tier is guys who can hold their own in pretty much any situation and lock down one side of the line. You expect frequent spotless or near-spotless games from them at least in pass protection. The second tier is guys who may need help from time to time with extra blockers and play design (or are still raw), but good enough to pretty much give you a chance most of the time and turn in great efforts at times. The third tier is guys who are a liability in at least one phase of the game and it should be assumed they will have a critical failure at least a few times a game and rarely, if ever, have a dominant game.

    Where does Oher fit in? It clearly seems to me to be the third group.




  4. #814
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Frederick, MD
    Posts
    31,932
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Whether they have "won anything" or not is irrelevant to the question of how good they are protecting the passer and blocking in the run game.

    Getting into arguments about rankings is usually pointless, but again, Oher is more TALENTED than a lot of tackles, but that doesn't mean he's better, because talent is only half of the equation. Technique (both mentally and physically) is the other and that's where Oher is lacking.

    If I were a GM I would take the following guys over Oher, each group in no particular order: FIRST TIER - 1) Joe Thomas 2) Trent Williams 3) Russell Okung 4) Duane Brown 5) Joe Staley 6) Ryan Clady 7) Andrew Whitworth 8) Michael Roos SECOND TIER - 9) Tyron Smith 10) Jordan Gross 11) Branden Albert 12) Jared Veldheer 13) D'Brickashaw Ferguson 14) Matt Kalil 15) Donald Penn 16) Eugene Monroe

    There's an easy 16 off the top of my head. Add Jason Peters to the first tier if he comes back healthy next year, Jared Gaither if he'll ever be healthy again (big if), and Jake Long if this year was some sort of fluke/injury issue. Nate Solder and Anthony Castonzo are a little too unproven to get there at this point but they're in the conversation for the second tier.

    Oher's category includes these guys, again in no order: 1) Oher 2) Will Beatty (who was actually fairly good this year but is injury prone) 3) Jeff Backus 4) Sam Baker 5) Jermon Bushrod 6) Max Starks 7) Chris Hairston, and then there's the REALLY bad guys like 8) Levi Brown, 9) Rodger Saffold, 10) Marshall Newhouse, and 11) J'Marcus Webb. That's all 32 starting LTs in the league.

    The first tier is guys who can hold their own in pretty much any situation and lock down one side of the line. You expect frequent spotless or near-spotless games from them at least in pass protection. The second tier is guys who may need help from time to time with extra blockers and play design (or are still raw), but good enough to pretty much give you a chance most of the time and turn in great efforts at times. The third tier is guys who are a liability in at least one phase of the game and it should be assumed they will have a critical failure at least a few times a game and rarely, if ever, have a dominant game.

    Where does Oher fit in? It clearly seems to me to be the third group.
    If Nate Solder and Anthony Costanzo are a little unproven, then you probably should classify Matt Kalil in there as well.
    Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer.

    -Arnold Schwarzenegger



    Check out Fatherhood Rules - a blog site dedicated to sports, food, music, movies, and politics.
    http://fatherhoodrules.com




  5. #815

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    If Nate Solder and Anthony Costanzo are a little unproven, then you probably should classify Matt Kalil in there as well.
    From what I've seen he's been absolutely lockdown in pass protection this year. He dominated Aldon Smith and Julius Peppers (twice!) and held his own against Clay Matthews among others. I think he's only given up like 2 or 3 sacks total this year and not many pressures/hurries.

    You don't step into the NFC North and lock down the LT position without being elite or close to elite, especially with a QB like Christian Ponder who is extremely tentative and holds the ball anyway. Kalil has shown more than enough in year 1 to make it at least into the second tier.




  6. #816

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    With Ray calling it quits i think it's more vital to get a ILB that can play right away...not because of losing Ray but because an Ogletree i dont think could beat out Mcclain in year one for the other LB spot because he wont be ready to play between the tackles. I personally dont wanna see Mcclain taking heavt snaps next year. I was thinking along the lines of this...

    Trade down from the first to the early 2nd round and take Aboushi, use that ammo to move up in the 2nd and take Kevin Minter or Arthur Brown. In the 3rd i'd take Baccari Rambo and in the 4th i'd take Missouri southern NT/DT Brandon Williams. I'd still sign a Terrance Knighton or Aubrayo Franklin while Williams is groomed to take over at the Nose, Williams can also play the 5-tech. With the rest of the draft i'd find another edge rusher to groom, a nickel LB, a backup QB and just go best available with whatever picks are left.




  7. #817
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Frederick, MD
    Posts
    31,932
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    From what I've seen he's been absolutely lockdown in pass protection this year. He dominated Aldon Smith and Julius Peppers (twice!) and held his own against Clay Matthews among others. I think he's only given up like 2 or 3 sacks total this year and not many pressures/hurries.

    You don't step into the NFC North and lock down the LT position without being elite or close to elite, especially with a QB like Christian Ponder who is extremely tentative and holds the ball anyway. Kalil has shown more than enough in year 1 to make it at least into the second tier.
    Fair enough. I really haven't watched too many Vikings games this year. I'm just always reserved when gauging rookies because you never know. Look at Jake Long.
    Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer.

    -Arnold Schwarzenegger



    Check out Fatherhood Rules - a blog site dedicated to sports, food, music, movies, and politics.
    http://fatherhoodrules.com




  8. #818

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Whether they have "won anything" or not is irrelevant to the question of how good they are protecting the passer and blocking in the run game.

    Getting into arguments about rankings is usually pointless, but again, Oher is more TALENTED than a lot of tackles, but that doesn't mean he's better, because talent is only half of the equation. Technique (both mentally and physically) is the other and that's where Oher is lacking.

    If I were a GM I would take the following guys over Oher, each group in no particular order: FIRST TIER - 1) Joe Thomas 2) Trent Williams 3) Russell Okung 4) Duane Brown 5) Joe Staley 6) Ryan Clady 7) Andrew Whitworth 8) Michael Roos SECOND TIER - 9) Tyron Smith 10) Jordan Gross 11) Branden Albert 12) Jared Veldheer 13) D'Brickashaw Ferguson 14) Matt Kalil 15) Donald Penn 16) Eugene Monroe

    There's an easy 16 off the top of my head. Add Jason Peters to the first tier if he comes back healthy next year, Jared Gaither if he'll ever be healthy again (big if), and Jake Long if this year was some sort of fluke/injury issue. Nate Solder and Anthony Castonzo are a little too unproven to get there at this point but they're in the conversation for the second tier.

    Oher's category includes these guys, again in no order: 1) Oher 2) Will Beatty (who was actually fairly good this year but is injury prone) 3) Jeff Backus 4) Sam Baker 5) Jermon Bushrod 6) Max Starks 7) Chris Hairston, and then there's the REALLY bad guys like 8) Levi Brown, 9) Rodger Saffold, 10) Marshall Newhouse, and 11) J'Marcus Webb. That's all 32 starting LTs in the league.

    The first tier is guys who can hold their own in pretty much any situation and lock down one side of the line. You expect frequent spotless or near-spotless games from them at least in pass protection. The second tier is guys who may need help from time to time with extra blockers and play design (or are still raw), but good enough to pretty much give you a chance most of the time and turn in great efforts at times. The third tier is guys who are a liability in at least one phase of the game and it should be assumed they will have a critical failure at least a few times a game and rarely, if ever, have a dominant game.

    Where does Oher fit in? It clearly seems to me to be the third group.
    Eh...I'd put him at the end of the second...I certainly think he is comparable to Penn and Monroe.

    I just don't think he is that bad...I certainly don't think he isn't in the top 20.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  9. #819

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Eh...I'd put him at the end of the second...I certainly think he is comparable to Penn and Monroe.

    I just don't think he is that bad...I certainly don't think he isn't in the top 20.
    You can quibble over whether he's 20th or 18th as much as you want, but he IS that bad. I went back and reviewed all of Filmstudy's excellent OL reviews of the year, and Oher's average score is a 68... which is a D+, and he's only had 3 games graded above a C. Most of his grades are D's, and that doesn't include the last game of the season, but I can tell you Oher gave up at least a sack, a QB hit, and 2 hurries through only 9 pass-blocking snaps. I would give him an F for his work with the first team in that game.

    By average grade, Oher has been the team's worst offensive lineman this year (excluding Bobbie Williams) and this has certainly been his worst season as a pro by far. He's trending downwards badly at this point and the worst thing is I think he knows full well how bad he's been this year and that's why he's starting to give up on a lot of blocks and not give 100% effort on the field.

    I really think the team needs to just move him to guard to try to salvage his confidence and make better use of his athleticism and strength. He could be a dominant zone-blocking left guard.




  10. #820

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    You can quibble over whether he's 20th or 18th as much as you want, but he IS that bad. I went back and reviewed all of Filmstudy's excellent OL reviews of the year, and Oher's average score is a 68... which is a D+, and he's only had 3 games graded above a C. Most of his grades are D's, and that doesn't include the last game of the season, but I can tell you Oher gave up at least a sack, a QB hit, and 2 hurries through only 9 pass-blocking snaps. I would give him an F for his work with the first team in that game.

    By average grade, Oher has been the team's worst offensive lineman this year (excluding Bobbie Williams) and this has certainly been his worst season as a pro by far. He's trending downwards badly at this point and the worst thing is I think he knows full well how bad he's been this year and that's why he's starting to give up on a lot of blocks and not give 100% effort on the field.

    I really think the team needs to just move him to guard to try to salvage his confidence and make better use of his athleticism and strength. He could be a dominant zone-blocking left guard.
    Here's the thing...you can't totally go off of Film's grades unless he graded the others.

    I'm simply saying that none of us...none of use pay anywhere near as close attention to other OT's to blatently say, Oher is ranked in the bottom 20. I simply don't believe that is true and that's really all I'm saying.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  11. #821
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Frederick, MD
    Posts
    31,932
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Here's the thing...you can't totally go off of Film's grades unless he graded the others.

    I'm simply saying that none of us...none of use pay anywhere near as close attention to other OT's to blatently say, Oher is ranked in the bottom 20. I simply don't believe that is true and that's really all I'm saying.
    It would be interesting to have some sort of a comparable threshold to gauge Michael Oher on.
    Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer.

    -Arnold Schwarzenegger



    Check out Fatherhood Rules - a blog site dedicated to sports, food, music, movies, and politics.
    http://fatherhoodrules.com




  12. #822

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    You can quibble over whether he's 20th or 18th as much as you want, but he IS that bad. I went back and reviewed all of Filmstudy's excellent OL reviews of the year, and Oher's average score is a 68... which is a D+, and he's only had 3 games graded above a C. Most of his grades are D's, and that doesn't include the last game of the season, but I can tell you Oher gave up at least a sack, a QB hit, and 2 hurries through only 9 pass-blocking snaps. I would give him an F for his work with the first team in that game.

    By average grade, Oher has been the team's worst offensive lineman this year (excluding Bobbie Williams) and this has certainly been his worst season as a pro by far. He's trending downwards badly at this point and the worst thing is I think he knows full well how bad he's been this year and that's why he's starting to give up on a lot of blocks and not give 100% effort on the field.

    I really think the team needs to just move him to guard to try to salvage his confidence and make better use of his athleticism and strength. He could be a dominant zone-blocking left guard.
    I'm jsut going to give Bmorecareful a big thumbs up, pretty much agreed all around. Oher is certainly outide the top 20, the tier's are pretty much exactly how ou list them, and Oher really is THAT bad. Bushrod may not be an upgrade, but he probably wouldn't be much of a downgrade either. You could say that Oher has the potential to be better then some, but what is curious to me is that all we hear about is his great work ethic, yet he has consistantly goten worse throughout his pro career. His rookie season was absolutely his best season, and it has been a steady decline to this yea, very obviously his worst season. I "suppose" last year at RT MAY have been better then the prior year at LT, maybe. Don't forget, last I knew he was leading the entire league at any position in penalties committed since the day he stepped on the field.

    Saffold might even be in Oher's area...

    Kalil is a stud... flat out stud.

    And the "they haven't won anything" argument is odd, because neither have Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitz, Andre Johnson or really any other top flight wideout.




  13. #823
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    "Merry old England"
    Posts
    9,307
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    I'm actually ''fall in love with a prospect mode'' with Matt Elam more than I have been for quite a long time. You wanna talk about replacing a vocal/emotional leader, that's Matt Elam. He plays like Ray Lewis as a safety, he isn't a ball hawk like Ed Reed, he's more of a Brian Dawkins. He is just a Raven through and through.




  14. #824
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    "Merry old England"
    Posts
    9,307
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    Matt Elam.

    He has kind of emerged as a legitimate 1st round possibility for the Ravens.
    I think Ozzie is going to take a long hard look at Elam, he just fits this team perfectly.

    It would be fun to see him and Pollard smashing the shit out of everyone.




  15. #825

    Re: New draft/FA/offseason thread

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    I think Ozzie is going to take a long hard look at Elam, he just fits this team perfectly.

    It would be fun to see him and Pollard smashing the shit out of everyone.
    I was just talking about that in an earlier post on this thread. Ed Reed used to be the best not only because he was an unparalleled ballhawk but also because now and again he would drop down from his FS spot and blitz for an unblocked sack or force a fumble from a RB. He can still be a force in coverage at times but he's not physical anymore and he doesn't make those scary plays shooting downfield like a missile anymore.

    Matt Elam is a guy who looks like he could be that sort of safety like Ed Reed used to be. VERY physical and good against the run... in addition to being able to cover man to man and over the top. Great player and I am also 100% on his bandwagon. He's my favorite safety in the class, I'm also a fan of Phillip Thomas, DJ Swearinger, and Kenny Vaccaro.




Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Russell Street Report Website Design by D3Corp Ocean City Maryland