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  1. #31
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens



    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    IMHO, the Ravens royally fucked themselves by not firing Cam 2 years ago.

    There is an underlying belief (a strong one by many fans on this board) that Joe just isn't going to get any better under this system with Cam. That's really all it is though...belief.

    They had a chance to really see what they have a couple years ago...to see for sure. Personally, while I think Cam is holding Joe back to a degree, I also think that Joe has some real imitations. That said, now the team is really backed into a corner here.

    This isn't the Chargers situation where they could let go of an above average Drew Brees (that's really all he was at the time). They had invested a top 4 pick for Rivers who had sat for 2 years in preparation for the starting job.

    We don't have anybody and would likely have to go with freaking Tyrod Taylor or a random rookie who wouldn't be a high draft pick.

    So they have to sign him and he has the organization by the balls and they know it...and it's all their fault.
    Great post....couldn't agree more!
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  2. #32
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirt1 View Post


    According to ESPN, Flacco is ranked #19 in the league so far this year in terms of passing stats. IMO, Flacco would need to rank a lot higher than that to justify kind of money he wants. If the Ravens want to be a run-first/balanced offense, then do they really need a $100+ million QB?

    http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/pl...rterbackRating
    Exactly what I speak to in the column. If the Ravens want an effective game manager, ok...then get one. But don't pay a game manager Top 5 QB money. You will crush the equitable distribution of cap dollars.
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  3. #33
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    I know that everyone is anti Ozzie lately, but I think what Ozzie did was offer Joe a contract that seemed right for purely how Joe has played so far (not sure of that sum, but I'd guess anywhere between 70 and 90 million) but Joe wants more because of the wins that his team has had over the years.

    Look, Joe is a good QB, above average for sure, but he isn't elite and never will be. Maybe he could have been better, and maybe his ceiling could have been higher had the coaching staff put him in a more QB friendly system, and I do put some blame on Steve and Ozzie for not cutting bait with Cam back in 2010. Cam is good for a young developmental QB, but after that, you really need to keep Cam away from a franchise QB.

    I heard the franchise tag is more in the range of 14-15 million in 2013, so we will just have to bite the bullet and pay that while seeing how he does working under a better OC. The team is going to need to bring in some guys in the offseason to help this team though, we need to upgrade our Oline and front 7, and make them what they used to be.




  4. #34
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post

    I heard the franchise tag is more in the range of 14-15 million in 2013, so we will just have to bite the bullet and pay that while seeing how he does working under a better OC. The team is going to need to bring in some guys in the offseason to help this team though, we need to upgrade our Oline and front 7, and make them what they used to be.
    I think the franchise tag is the best option. It is a lot of money, but it buys time and a team could offer Flacco a contract and they'd have to give the Ravens 2 1st round picks.




  5. #35

    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    I think the franchise tag is the best option. It is a lot of money, but it buys time and a team could offer Flacco a contract and they'd have to give the Ravens 2 1st round picks.
    I believe Al Davis died last year.




  6. #36
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBKistler View Post
    I believe Al Davis died last year.
    lol good point




  7. #37

    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    My approach would be to franchise Joe and fire Cam. You might have to blow up the team a little to afford the tag but I think most of us would be fine if it meant that we would move past being a bridesmaid every year.

    You work with Joe in the offseason to see what kind of system he would be most effective in (just about any other) and hire a coach who can compliment him. I would use the next year to judge him for long term purpose - which, although it may seem unfair to judge him on one year, I feel as though he's eroded my confidence with these kind of numbers:

    12th Yards
    18th Yards/Attempt
    19th Touchdowns
    19th Passer Rating
    23rd Completion Pct.
    6th Most Sacked




  8. #38

    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    I think the franchise tag is the best option. It is a lot of money, but it buys time and a team could offer Flacco a contract and they'd have to give the Ravens 2 1st round picks.
    Washington gave up more than that to get Robert Griffin III, a guy who had never even taken an NFL snap, much less led his team within a dropped pass of the Super Bowl. (Obviously they don't regret it now because RGIII certainly appears to be a franchise QB.)

    Buffalo, New York (Jets), Kansas City, Arizona, and Jacksonville would all give up 2 first rounders in a heartbeat to acquire Flacco, and he would probably instantly make Arizona the favorite to win their division in 2013.

    It doesn't matter though, because if Flacco gets tagged, he will get the EXCLUSIVE tag and no other team would be able to sign him to an offer sheet.




  9. #39
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    The one thing that is SINKING this team right now is Managment!!!

    From top to bottom.

    From the Biscuit to the lowest coach on the totem pole.

    The whole thing about Harbs almost losing the team and having the meeting that put it all back together.....

    The real question is how did it get to that point?

    It was so interesting that 1 Winning Drive showed Q telling CAM that the middle of the field is wide open. CAM with the befuddled look and saying Really?!?!

    I wish I could have been there to say. Yeah fuckwad just like every other game this year, last year, etc etc etc.




  10. #40
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    I don't think anyone could really argue against this. I mean Manning might make a few better decisions here and there, like choosing not to throw a deep ball, but everytime I see Joe chuck one deep, no one is really open underneath.
    Did Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers look like shit under Cameron when they had the Chargers offense ranked #3, #5, and #1 in the league from 2004-2006?

    Just think about that. As recently as 2006, Cameron's so called "ancient" offense was the top offense in the league and scored nearly 70 points more than the next closest team. Are we really sure that Cameron (and Joe, for that matter) are the problem and not the man at the top...?




  11. #41

    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    A column from Brian detailing the cap ramifications of franchising Joe next year would be most appreciated. I assume Boldin is a goner. Ed Reed too?




  12. #42
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhcforlife View Post
    Did Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers look like shit under Cameron when they had the Chargers offense ranked #3, #5, and #1 in the league from 2004-2006?

    Just think about that. As recently as 2006, Cameron's so called "ancient" offense was the top offense in the league and scored nearly 70 points more than the next closest team. Are we really sure that Cameron (and Joe, for that matter) are the problem and not the man at the top...?
    That's a good point. But I think the problem is both or a combination of Harbs conservative approach and Cam's style of offense.

    You could have more success (IMO) with a different offense that wasn't too risky (AKA conservative Harbaugh approach) then we do now.

    For example, look at New England, 3 - 5 step drops quick slants etc. OR a game plan like the Steelers did to us Wide receiver screens, fake WR screens TE up the middle.

    My point is I think Harbaugh's approach with Cam's style offense is whats hindered this offense/ Joe from really taking the next step.
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  13. #43
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    That's a good point. But I think the problem is both or a combination of Harbs conservative approach and Cam's style of offense.

    You could have more success (IMO) with a different offense that wasn't too risky (AKA conservative Harbaugh approach) then we do now.

    For example, look at New England, 3 - 5 step drops quick slants etc. OR a game plan like the Steelers did to us Wide receiver screens, fake WR screens TE up the middle.

    My point is I think Harbaugh's approach with Cam's style offense is whats hindered this offense/ Joe from really taking the next step.
    Thank you... though it is hard to believe we are on the same page! LOL




  14. #44
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    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhcforlife View Post
    Did Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers look like shit under Cameron when they had the Chargers offense ranked #3, #5, and #1 in the league from 2004-2006?

    Just think about that. As recently as 2006, Cameron's so called "ancient" offense was the top offense in the league and scored nearly 70 points more than the next closest team. Are we really sure that Cameron (and Joe, for that matter) are the problem and not the man at the top...?
    Be careful spewing that bullshit. 2006 is also the year that LT rushed for over 1800 yards and 28 rushing TD's.

    Rivers stats in 06

    92 QBR, 61.7 completion percentage, 3388 yards, 22 tds and 9 interceptions. Those are not exactly top flight numbers. In fact those numbers look eerily similar to Flacco's numbers his entire career.

    None of the above is an endorsement for Cam's ability to develop a QB.




  15. #45

    Re: Overpaying Flacco could sink the Ravens

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBKistler View Post
    I believe Al Davis died last year.
    They also fired Hue Jackson
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




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