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  1. #151
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?



    Quote Originally Posted by rharris1986 View Post
    Whey you have an idiot calling the plays, creating the schemes, and making the decisions about what personnel to put on the field for each play not even Houdini could get out of that box!
    I'm firmly in the fire Cam camp. Cam is just a joke. It's not fair to hammer Flacco for playing in this 1960's offense.




  2. #152
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    I'm firmly in the fire Cam camp. Cam is just a joke. It's not fair to hammer Flacco for playing in this 1960's offense.
    They'll just move Caldy up to OC ,most likely and we'll be in a worse position than now.
    If they are gonna bring someone better in here, than great, but Harbs is a family man and that probably won't happen.
    Someone who knew his Uncle Bob in the 3rd grade or Caldy, take your pic.




  3. #153

    Re: What is Joe worth?

    Quote Originally Posted by houstonravensfan View Post
    Where did you read me say that we should have two franchise QBS? I said “a very few other teams" have an experienced backup. Did you hear about the game today? The Steelers had to play their second "experienced backup" because their first "experienced backup" was out. And here's a news flash for you: their 3rd string experienced backup beat us. Now for extra credit, here is a pop quiz: who is our third string QB? How many starts has he had? Too tough for you? How many pro starts has our 2nd string QB had? Beginning to see a thread of meaning here?
    Cute response, but you're moving the goalposts. Experienced backups are there so they can give you a shot at winning a game or two in the event your QB sprains his throwing arm. That's why the Steelers played Charlie Batch. But that's not what you're talking about. You're talking about having a fallback option in the context of negotiating a new contract for Flacco, and that's silly.

    Here's a news flash for you: Charlie Batch was on the Steelers roster in March 2008, but he was totally, completely, utterly irrelevant to the question of whether or not the Steelers were going to re-sign Ben Roethlisberger. They did, at 8 years/102m, and there was never any question that they wouldn't. That's because Roethlisberger is a franchise QB, and even if Flacco has been uneven over his career, so is he.

    The implication you and others are making is that if the Ravens had an "experienced backup" or "young developmental QB" on the roster, then they would have more leverage in negotiating a contract with Flacco. But that's not true, because there is NO POSSIBILITY that the Ravens would let Flacco walk unless they had somebody DAMN close on the bench, and they don't.

    "But why didn't they draft one in the later rounds of the draft!" you cry. Have a look at this:

    http://www.pro-football-reference.co...e=any&show=all

    29 "developmental" QBs drafted in the 3rd round and later since 2009. This includes such luminaries as Dan LeFevour, Nate Davis, and Colt McCoy... oh wait, 2 of those 3 are out of the league and the other one is firmly plastered to the bench in favor of a 29 year old rookie. Yeah, having those guys to wave in Flacco's face would sure make a strong negotiating chip.

    And this is all ignoring the fact that the marginal value between a "decent QB we can live with" and "good QB who's going to cost a pretty penny" is HUGE, vastly moreso than any other position in football. Take the Patriots between 07 and 08... Tom Brady orchestrated a 16-0 Super Bowl team, and the next year Matt Cassel (with the same team around him) could only get to 11-5, missing the playoffs.

    So how do you feel about dumping Flacco, trading for/signing whoever the unproven flavor of the weak is (say, Ryan Mallet) and seeing where the chips fall? I'll leave that to you to decide.




  4. #154
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by rharris1986 View Post
    Whey you have an idiot calling the plays, creating the schemes, and making the decisions about what personnel to put on the field for each play not even Houdini could get out of that box!
    Haha that is a great line...

    The video explains how the offensive players must feel....





  5. #155

    Re: What is Joe worth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jsmoove View Post
    Ravor, say we get a talented cordinator next season and flacco is lighting up the league like ryan this year, couldn't they sign him mid-season to a long term deal?
    No, with the Tag, he must be re-signed by July 15th or he must play the year under the franchise tag. Once the season is over, he could then sign an extension.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

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  6. #156

    Re: What is Joe worth?

    Let me add one caveat to my post above: I don't 100% condone what the Ravens have done with the Flacco situation, nor do I think the right course of action is just to cave and give in to whatever he demands. But just because a team is in a less than ideal negotiating situation doesn't mean a deal isn't possible. The Colts and Patriots both successfully negotiated new contracts for Manning and Brady in years past, with the understanding of all parties that there was NO WAY either team was going to let their future HOFer walk. And the Colts did that despite making Manning play out his full contract AND tagging him for a year as well.

    If the only way teams could negotiate new deals is if they were ready at the drop of a hat to break off negotiations and let a critical player walk, no deals would ever get done in this league. And even if they DON'T re-sign Flacco (99% impossible), I'm not arguing that they are just going to fold up the franchise. They will just have to undergo the difficult process of finding a new franchise QB, likely through the draft.




  7. #157
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    Re: What is Joe worth?

    SOLO pretty much hit it on the head with how they handled this cam flacco situation..they fucked up




  8. #158
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    Re: Why Joe's the problem

    I've seen Tom Brady get chewed out by his offensive coordinator, and Brady doesn't even call his own plays. He gets his plays from the sideline. He admitted as much. His plays are just better to work with in his system.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  9. #159
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    I'm firmly in the fire Cam camp. Cam is just a joke. It's not fair to hammer Flacco for playing in this 1960's offense.
    I'm all for dumping Cam, no question. Even if Cam were gone though, how does that improve Flacco's technique? Would it instill more confidence perhaps? I dunno...the only way I suppose we'll know is to have Flacco play one year under a different OC. Flacco is certainly stifled under Cam but Cam is not the entire problem.




  10. #160
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravens27Girl View Post
    I'm all for dumping Cam, no question. Even if Cam were gone though, how does that improve Flacco's technique? Would it instill more confidence perhaps? I dunno...the only way I suppose we'll know is to have Flacco play one year under a different OC. Flacco is certainly stifled under Cam but Cam is not the entire problem.
    I can tell ya this much. When CAM is gone... The players will say things about what was going on. Players that have left here have said things.




  11. #161
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    Re: How has Caldwell benefited Flacco?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravens27Girl View Post
    I'm all for dumping Cam, no question. Even if Cam were gone though, how does that improve Flacco's technique? Would it instill more confidence perhaps? I dunno...the only way I suppose we'll know is to have Flacco play one year under a different OC. Flacco is certainly stifled under Cam but Cam is not the entire problem.
    flacco has pretty sound technique, this Oline paired with cam's scheme is not putting flacco in a position to succeed and take it to the next level, like preached for the last 3 years while cam was good in joe's progression as rookie and young QB he doesn't posses the necessary skills to take flacco to the next step




  12. #162
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    Re: Why Joe's the problem

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    I've seen Tom Brady get chewed out by his offensive coordinator, and Brady doesn't even call his own plays. He gets his plays from the sideline. He admitted as much. His plays are just better to work with in his system.
    The Patriots' offense is a prime example of getting the ball to your best play makers in space. It's not a fluke that Gronkowski and Hernandez are ALWAYS open for fade passes in the corner of the end zone. That shit is by design.

    How often to we see Brady chucking it 50 yards down field? Hardly ever. He doesn't have to. The last time I've seen Brady really throw a lot of deep balls was when they had Randy Moss. Even then, Welker was their primary target and he hardly ever ran routes that were longer than 10-12 yards.
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  13. #163
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    Re: What is Joe worth?

    Yeah I'm kinda in the tag him, the tag for a QB is what 14.5M next year? Lets see what he can do under a different coordinator and go from there.

    All in all it could be a LOT worse. Look at Sanchez and the Jets. I really think he's worse than Boller. Really when you're only rattling of a handfull of names better than Joe thats alot better than what some teams are dealing with.




  14. #164
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    Joe Flacco is going to have to use his legs more.

    I'm sorry, there's just no way around it. I used to brush off the idea from some fans that Joe doesn't use his legs enough, but it's clear now that it has been a legitimate gripe.

    There comes a time in every QB's career where he has to find a way to make it happen when everything around him is going to pieces. We've seen Aaron Rodgers operate with some banged up offensive lines. We've seen Eli Manning work behind some bad offensive lines the past couple of years.

    The offensive line is full of young potential, with an aged C in the middle, I think we all agree. The reality is that it just isn't there yet. The WRs are all being blanketed on the outside. Boldin seems unable to barely separate at all, no matter where you put him on the field. Jones plays very small for a 6' 2" WR and Torrey is still young. Cam Cameron seems oblivious to the middle of the field.

    When the play breaks down, Joe is going to have to use his legs more to tighten up the defense and loosen things up for the offense.

    After he's gone through two or three reads, with his legs, he just needs to get out and get some yardage. His long strides run off two or three yards at a time.

    There's just no way around it. Joe is going to have to carry this team and he's going to have to be the spark for this offense. It's going to have to start with him using his legs. Nothing else is going to change between now and the end of the season. Joe is going to have to do this or they won't make the Super Bowl.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  15. #165
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    Re: Joe Flacco is going to have to use his legs more.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    I'm sorry, there's just no way around it. I used to brush off the idea from some fans that Joe doesn't use his legs enough, but it's clear now that it has been a legitimate gripe.

    There comes a time in every QB's career where he has to find a way to make it happen when everything around him is going to pieces. We've seen Aaron Rodgers operate with some banged up offensive lines. We've seen Eli Manning work behind some bad offensive lines the past couple of years.

    The offensive line is full of young potential, with an aged C in the middle, I think we all agree. The reality is that it just isn't there yet. The WRs are all being blanketed on the outside. Boldin seems unable to barely separate at all, no matter where you put him on the field. Jones plays very small for a 6' 2" WR and Torrey is still young. Cam Cameron seems oblivious to the middle of the field.

    When the play breaks down, Joe is going to have to use his legs more to tighten up the defense and loosen things up for the offense.

    After he's gone through two or three reads, with his legs, he just needs to get out and get some yardage. His long strides run off two or three yards at a time.

    There's just no way around it. Joe is going to have to carry this team and he's going to have to be the spark for this offense. It's going to have to start with him using his legs. Nothing else is going to change between now and the end of the season. Joe is going to have to do this or they won't make the Super Bowl.
    that one pass where he had smith in the middle of field while he was on the run, if he had tuck the ball and run he would have had it, Joe is going to have start doing that a lot more I know he aint no A-ROD but if its open take that shit.




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