Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 43
  1. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Pasadena
    Posts
    10,127
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe



    For whatever reason, when Joe goes into a 4 minute or 2 minute hurry up offense on the road, he's almost unbeatable. Look at the last year in Pittsburgh or the year before in Pitt or the last part of the AFC championship game. You gotta wonder if Joe get's more leeway in that he gets several plays to pick from, and he just calls what he wants at the line. Also, I think Joe is definitely a rhythm QB. Once he starts stringing some completions together, he gets hot and keeps things moving.




  2. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    1,791

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    My opinion is that everyone, including the author of the Sports Illustrated article, has completely the wrong perspective on Joe's confidence. Does he have a confidence problem that seems exacerbated on the road? Yes, I think so, nobody is wrong about that. But what everyone has overlooked or mis-attributed is where that confidence problem lies exactly. Anybody who ever listens to Flacco knows he has a lot of confidence in himself. I would suggest that his confidence problem lies with his teammates. He doesn't trust that O line to hold. It's not that he doesn't trust HIMSELF, no, that's not why he doesn't stay in the pocket, step to the side, wait for the receiver to get open, make the play happen. No, no, no. He doesn't trust his O line. He doesn't have CONFIDENCE that the O line will protect him long enough to wait for that play to develop. And I believe the reason he doesn't have that confidence on the road, but does seem to have it at home, is because there is an actual, true discrepancy in the O line's performance on the road versus at home. On the road, we don't seem to do a good job of disguising the play, and we do an even worse job at disguising the snap count. This leads to the defense seemingly knowing exactly where to come at the QB, and exactly WHEN to come at the QB. So in the end, I would say that the blame lies mostly on whoever is responsible for keeping the play and the snap a mystery to the defense on the road.




  3. #18

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    etc., etc., etc,!




  4. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Baltimore
    Posts
    1,235

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by rharris1986 View Post
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    Play Calling
    etc., etc., etc,!
    I will add this...because I think this is a bigger part of the problem...Play design.
    When the play design does not fit the players' strengths or help put them in the best position to succeed, it will not matter what play is called.




  5. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Pasadena
    Posts
    10,127
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravens44 View Post
    I will add this...because I think this is a bigger part of the problem...Play design.
    When the play design does not fit the players' strengths or help put them in the best position to succeed, it will not matter what play is called.
    Someone needs to post the stats of which part of the field is being used for passes. I saw one where the sidelines were in the 60's and the middle was in the teens.




  6. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Baltimore
    Posts
    1,235

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    Someone needs to post the stats of which part of the field is being used for passes. I saw one where the sidelines were in the 60's and the middle was in the teens.
    Yes, I would be interested in that, too.
    So many fans have complained about the same things for years.

    We know that many times, the routes are not run to the 1st down sticks, so the player has to make a great individual effort to get the first.

    We know the receivers, for years now, regardless of their age, experience, size, or speed, CANNOT get separation.
    That means each receiver, when the ball is thrown towards him into that tiny little window Joe has to work with, each receiver has to fight for the ball or make a spectacular catch on what should be just normal plays.

    We also know that every week, we all see opposing offenses use different formations and rubs and pairings of receivers to naturally gain separation without breaking the rules, helping the receivers, as well as, the quarterback succeed. And many times, those opposing players are not as good as our current roster.

    I believe, that with this group of offensive skill players, there is not one team in this league that should be able to shutdown our offense.
    If our receivers were running free with at least 3 yards separation like every other team in the league, we would see Joe simply flourish.
    He wouldn't need 5-6 seconds to find a receiver who has position but no separation and then try to fit the ball through the defender's ear hole to get it to his receiver.

    This is what I see week in and week out.

    Now, opposing defenses have figured out to flip their safeties and corners to undercut Joe's out passes and yet cover our speed guys over the top.
    Cam did not figure this out, nor did his coaches upstairs tell him.
    Yet, that is what the Steelers did the entire game the week before...
    so, the Chargers, who actually watch tape, did it, too.
    It took Boldin, during last game to tell Cam about it before anything changed and THEN in the second half, starting using other parts of the field and Joe starting having success.

    These are the things that frustrate the fans who see the same thing every week, while the coaches continue to live in a bubble cut off from the outside world, and relentlessly run the same plays that other teams are sitting there waiting for.




  7. #22

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    I don't buy into the "confidence" argument, because we've *all* seen that when the pressure is on then Joe plays his best.

    I don't know what accounts for the difference but I suspect it has to do with scheme & play calling, as others have said.

    If Joe played consistently poorly *within* games on the road I might buy into this story of home Joe/road Joe, but anyone who watches Ravens football knows that within a game you will see "home Joe" on the road sometimes, particularly in the 2 minute offense.

    I don't know what's really going on, but I am (still) skeptical of the home/road distinction & backseat psychiatric analysis of Joe. I think it's something else, perhaps related to the road scheme & play calling. Perhaps not.
    Festivus

    His definitions and arguments were so clear in his own mind that he was unable to understand how any reasonable person could honestly differ with him.




  8. #23

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Now if we're addressing Cams play calling, as I've seen you post before, it's not so much the play calling, it's the system and those long ass developing routes, that's the problem here. You can't just have your QB sit back and wait for someone to get open, our Oline would need JO back at LT and a bunch of all pro's to do that in todays league.
    Those long developing plays kill a mediocre offensive line. Makes them look worse than what they are.

    Part of the reason why nobody is a fan of Cam.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.




  9. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    "Merry old England"
    Posts
    9,307
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Those long developing plays kill a mediocre offensive line. Makes them look worse than what they are.

    Part of the reason why nobody is a fan of Cam.


    Even when we had the best line in the league from 08 to 09 they struggled in pass pro with this system.




  10. #25

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Joe not having confidence in his OL protecting him on the road is a well founded reason for the discrepancy, IMO. We've seen in the past Joe on the road getting destroyed almost immediately b/c of breakdown in OL protection (ie. Allen in Minny, numerous Steeler games among others). As a QB your natural response is to avoid getting hurt and we know Joe is good at that. As a result Joe's internal timeclock on the road is much shorter. Because of Joe's road timeclock quickened, he will miss a few opportunities when the OL actually does provide better protection on specific plays but unfortunately Joe has already released the pass before a better pass option has opened up. Its a Catch 22.. Sure we want Joe to slow it down a bit on the road b/c there would be nice opportunities downfield from the longer developing routes in the Cam offense if Joe waits a little long. Yet we dont want Joe to wait too long and get himself hurt. We are screwed then. If there is one QB skillset which Joe possesses that might be average or possibly below is anticipating the rush and making the small movements to buy yourself some extra time (again my opinion). Given all these factors, I still come back to Cam to remedy the 'road woes'. It is his job to make things easier for the offense. The long developing downfield patterns that are explosive when successful but unsuccessful without good pass pro should not be a staple. Sure we still keep them in, but we need more quicker developing patterns...... more bunch formations/crossing patterns. You know, the same changes we've bitched about forever. Hey at least we saw Torrey on the inside successfully take those crossing patterns for nice gains. That was something out of the ordinary for Cam.




  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    over by the dental floss bush
    Posts
    17,949
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    That's a great article and a refreshing look at specifics (as opposed to idiocy of rharris)
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  12. #27
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The Land of Verdite
    Posts
    13,360
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    I think that one major reason why posters are reluctant to place the majority of the blame at Flacco's feet is, because he's stepped up at the most crucial moments, in the most crucial games. When you don't have to 'shield' your QB, in the big moments of the big games, you know that you have something special and we've all seen it.

    Psychologically, it seems clear to me that Joe Flacco has all of the confidence in the world, in himself. He wants to go for the throat. However, particularly when things get 'tough', on the road, the coaching philosophy does not match what Joe really wants to do. The coaching philosophy becomes, 'play it safe, keep it close and win it in the fourth quarter'. That's why they come on so strong in the fourth and have done so the past few years.

    The issue with the offensive line is where it starts. Joe does not seem to have the same confidence in the offensive line, on the road, because they just don't play as well.

    Now, this is where I feel that someone like Caldwell would be a better coordinator. In Indianapolis, the one thing that Peyton wanted to do was go deep and go for the throat. However, in trying to contain him, teams kept their safeties back. So, Peyton and Co. found ways to move the safeties up and/or deal with the blitz. They set up the deeper routes with the slants and ins of the world. After a while, teams were forced to play those routes. That's when Peyton started hitting the sluggos' and the in-and-ups. That's what he wanted to do all along.

    That's what Flacco wants to do here. Where Caldwell has helped is in teaching Flacco how to use fake audibles to his advantage, to manipulate the defense. We've seen that more at home. However, on the road where the line does not play as well, this is where Cameron needs to provide those slants', ins' and crossing patterns to set up what they really want to do. You actually saw some of that last week and it eventually opened up the deeper routes.

    On the road, they just don't do it consistently enough. Using those routes can also help get the line into a rhythm.

    Part of that is Cameron's administration of the scheme. Part of that is Harbaugh's conservative approach. Both lend themselves to waiting, until they absolutely have to, to turn the offense over to Flacco again. Instead of using those slants and crossing routes earlier in the game, to help the offense maintain any sense of momentum, thus 'working through the problems', like I've been complaining about for two years now, they'll go conservative and wait until the last minutes to finally let Flacco run the show again.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  13. #28

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Have to take issue with the article claiming that the O-line is virtually the same in the two games they compared.

    Against Dallas--1 sack, 3 qb hits

    Against San Diego--5 sacks, 6 qb hits

    Granted Flacco passed it 15 more times against the Chargers, and the ravens ran almost double the number of plays against the Chargers as they did against the Cowboys.

    But also against Dallas there were 2 TFL and against San Diego there were 9 TKL.

    Not the same level of performance by the men up front if you ask me.




  14. #29

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Hi. new guy here. I`ve been here before, but forgotten my name.

    I don`t agree with the article. Like many have said before, Flacco plays his best when the pressure is on. I think it`s a combination of playdesign, incosistent blocking and conservative mentality/playcalling.
    Let`s look at a couple of things.
    Flacco has a better completion % on 3rd and long, then 3rd and short. How is that possible?
    Flacco would have close to elite stats if he could only get his TDs up. Why does he have so few TDs? The Ravens compared to other teams rarely throw the ball inside the opponents 10 and 20, despite Joe not being particular error prone in that area.
    Fewest attempts in the league inside the 10. And amoung the fewest inside the 20. Why is that? I think it may be the same reason we`re so horrible passing on 3rd and short. Playdesign and situational playcalling. Our offense is not built for those situations. It seems even the short routes takes long to develop. We need more quick timing patterns. I would love to see some more slants or quick comebacks. Those plays has a chance to go for big yardage, if Torrey just makes 1 guy miss. It would also help our o-line on the road. Add to that, I think Harbaugh is a conservative coach, which makes him especially conservative on the road. Haurbaugh saying we want to bring AFC north football to the west coast was a hint. Also the fact that they have a great home field advantage makes them look really bad in comparrison.




  15. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Frederick, MD
    Posts
    31,911
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: si.com compares home Joe vs. road Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn View Post
    Those long developing plays kill a mediocre offensive line. Makes them look worse than what they are.

    Part of the reason why nobody is a fan of Cam.





    Oh, and
    Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer.

    -Arnold Schwarzenegger



    Check out Fatherhood Rules - a blog site dedicated to sports, food, music, movies, and politics.
    http://fatherhoodrules.com




Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Russell Street Report Website Design by D3Corp Ocean City Maryland